Sporting (H) - UCL - 26/10, 8pm

[OffTheBench]

you say that now but if the shoe was on the other foot and that potentially puts us out of europe i want them getting it right. you want the game to be as honest as possible,i dont want winners coming from bent decisions, seen enough of that over the years and we have been the ones falling victim to it.

offsides are black and white its not like a foul where it can be subjective. they need better technology to help get thee decisions ironed out in under 10 seconds. 4 minutes is a joke

But don't you think yesterday was a text book example of how offsides aren't always black and white? There's a lot of grey between the black and white.

The technology will no doubt get more complex in the hunt of "perfection". However I really don't think it would make football better.

With that tech route, you'd need dozens if not hundreds of 120fps video cameras along the touchline and overhead too. And you still wouldn't be able to always solve everything, such as when players are blocking views of balls and limbs, or the exact millisecond that the ball is played. Is it the final millisecond when the ball is touching the player? When the ball leaves? How to account for flex in the ball? What if Cucurella's afro means you can't tell? What if the white lines are 1cm out of line across the pitch?

All that complexity adds no enjoyment to the sport at all. Just make the VAR lines a bit wider.

 

[bunburyist]

Made it to the stadion last night, god that first half was abysmal.

It's even more apparent that if we are to have zero go forward from central midfield then we absolutely must from our wide players. But then it got me thinking, what do we have in terms of go forward either passing ability of beating a man.

Lloris is an average distributer of the ball

Davies and Dier offer next to nothing in terms of go forward, Romero is average.

Perisic is good at getting the ball into the front players. Hojbjerg and Bentancur average, Sessegnon, Doherty, Emerson offer very little.

Last night the only players offering anything were Perisic and Kane, and then Gil who I thought was a revelation when he came on.

It's clear that if Kulu isn't playing it entirely rests on Kane's shoulders and a one man attack is easy to stifle.

 

[mummy]

It's still BS when looking at the defender on Kane!

ALSO!!!! There is no way to confirm the point it left Royal's head.

This is the same moment, from a different angle. My arrow is pointing towards what appears to be the Sporting player's boot playing Kane onside...

And again - even more conclusively...

ONSIDE

 

[scarletjim]

I don't. I only want it to be called offside if it's clearly an offside. If the attacker is gaining an advantage.
If it's a matter of millimetres it just doesn't matter and it ruins the game checking it for multiple minutes.

Problem with that is, where's the line? ( ) How many mm do you want to be ok to be offside but called onside by VAR? Surely it's easier to measure black and white as they are trying to do here than to set an arbitrary amount, say 10mm, than try to judge if a player is over or under 10mm further forward?

Don't get me wrong, I'd love VAR either scrapped, or only allowed 30 seconds to change the refs on-field decision - but when people say they want only 'clear offsides' to be called out, I'm never surely exactly what they mean. And it would need to be exact - we can't have refs, fans, pundits or VAR people just deciding incident by incident whether a player was 'enough' offside to call it, that would be even worse than the shambles we have now.

 

[CarrieFi]

It’s worrying that a 0-0 will do us in France. I can see conte going and playing for that.

That would be hideous

I don’t want another Dinamo Zagreb scenario :contefacepalm::contefacepalm2:

 

[Frankfurter]

I can't calm down!
I keep thinking about the goal that was not scored and now I see pictures where a non-sighted person could see that the Portoguese has his quanta in front of Harry Kane!

Another question bothers me!
Tottenham Hotspur didn't put together their squad according to social criteria.
You didn't take people who would otherwise have been without permanent accommodation, but people who can play football.
Consequently, it must be possible to expect game intelligence!
Is it a question of mentality that lately (?) Spurs aren't performing the way one might expect from their composition, or am I wrong here?

Someone wrote that apparently it is enough to reach the CL or EL places - so that money bubbles into the cash register.
But are those who say game culture is just as important completely wrong?

Now it's getting completely football romantic:
I find it completely incomprehensible that a team that plays for this club doesn't concentrate on its task from the first to the last second, doesn't say it's about Tottenham Hotspur, a club that there will be long before me and long after me and where I am lucky enough to be able to play!
They should look to players like Glenn Hoddle, Jimmy Greaves, Paul Gascoigne and Pat Jennings!

COYS!

We can't just hope that we'll only score points against teams from the lower midfield!

 

[mikes01666]

Bentancur average,

?

He was a monster in the second half.

Lloris saved a couple of certainties which he owes us after the last two games.

Granted, everyone in the first half was 1/10.

 

[OffTheBench]

Problem with that is, where's the line? ( ) How many mm do you want to be ok to be offside but called onside by VAR? Surely it's easier to measure black and white as they are trying to do here than to set an arbitrary amount, say 10mm, than try to judge if a player is over or under 10mm further forward?

Don't get me wrong, I'd love VAR either scrapped, or only allowed 30 seconds to change the refs on-field decision - but when people say they want only 'clear offsides' to be called out, I'm never surely exactly what they mean. And it would need to be exact - we can't have refs, fans, pundits or VAR people just deciding incident by incident whether a player was 'enough' offside to call it, that would be even worse than the shambles we have now.

Step 1. The two lines still go exactly where the VAR thinks they should go, he/she gets a nice razor thin line to work with like now.

Step 2. the line is then automatically made wider to recognise that the VAR's placement cannot be perfect, given uncertainty in when the ball is "played" and the fact the ball moves between frames.

I don't know what the width should be, it will be something like 5cm of pitch. There is surely a scientific approach that accounts for the margin of uncertainty in the measurement.

Step 3. If the two lines still don't overlap then it's offside.

It would result in fewer microscopic offsides (where the attacker really isn't getting a true "benefit") but still catch all obvious offsides.

Problem solved, thank you very much.

 

[bunburyist]

?

He was a monster in the second half.

Lloris saved a couple of certainties which he owes us after the last two games.

Granted, everyone in the first half was 1/10.

That isn’t what I said - I was going through the team in terms of go forward. We offer very little, Bentancur included.

That first half was amongst the worst I’ve ever seen. Barely more than a handful of meaningful forward passes in 45mi

 

[matspur]

This is the same moment, from a different angle. My arrow is pointing towards what appears to be the Sporting player's boot playing Kane onside...

And again - even more conclusively...

ONSIDE

We were robbed. If it takes them 4 minutes to try to find a reason to exclude the goal and then all they can show after that time is inconclusive footage then how on Earth can they overturn the referee’s decision. And it’s not the first time we’ve been done by questionable interpretation of VAR either. In the 2019/2020 season we were away at Leicester and Son was adjudged offside in the build up to a goal that would have put us 2-0 up. They drew on the daft VAR lines and it still looked onside. We went on to lose 2-1. I think that this sport is a lot less honest than we realise at times

 

[Gilded Lily]

Listened to the gave live on BBC and then got to watch it today. On the BBC the crowd in the second half sounded loud and enthusiastic. On the TV replay the crowd didn't sound nearly as enthusiastic. For anyone who was there, what did it sound like in person? I'm assuming the way matches are produced for radio they crowd noise is mixed much higher.

I was in the south east corner. Loud at the start then, unsurprisingly, quiet for most of the first half. Last half hour was good, with plenty of singing. I just watched the end back on BT and agree it seems too quiet, but does depend where you are in the stadium sometimes.

 

[McCOYS]

Rio Ferdinand and Peter Crouch explain the offside.

 

[mummy]

That isn’t what I said - I was going through the team in terms of go forward. We offer very little, Bentancur included.

That first half was amongst the worst I’ve ever seen. Barely more than a handful of meaningful forward passes in 45mi

That's why Skipp needs to be given more game time. He knows what to do with the ball and has a natural attacking instinct.

 

[bonaspur23]

It also shows how little we know about the offside rule after all the tinkering over the last few years.

And there I thought (and so did Dier!) that you can't be offside if the ball isn't played forward...

That’s never, ever, ever, ever been a rule.

In England they must teach you guys some weird things. Almost every player I’ve played with knows that what matters is if the receiving player is behind/ahead of the ball when it’s played. Americans don’t do many things right in football but I guess at least teaching the rule is one of them.

I can see the confusion… it’s very unlikely a player is offsides on a ball played backwards, but the direction the ball is played has nothing to do with offsides.

 

[bonaspur23]

This is the same moment, from a different angle. My arrow is pointing towards what appears to be the Sporting player's boot playing Kane onside...

And again - even more conclusively...

ONSIDE

Different frame than the one they chose. Load of BS this millimeter offsides is.

 

[deadleyledley]

No pressing
No closing down
No possession
No passing

This isn´t Spurs

Our last three manager appointments have been awful, none of them have represented what Spurs is all about. As i´ve said all along, we should have gone for Potter.

And stop this fucking back-5, we don´t have the players for it!!!

I´m pretty sure that if we played with a back-4, and played offensive football we would flourish, look att Son and Moura they look depressed having to play defensive football.

Our best players are the forwards, so it´s beyond me why he insist of playing this defensive shit.

Personally i´m back to where i was before Conte, i don´t look forward to the games, and i expect us to lose.

 

[mummy]

Rio Ferdinand and Peter Crouch explain the offside.

Their analysis is bollocks, because the freeze-frame they've chosen to draw their line on is slightly BEFORE Emerson heads the ball. By the time he heads the ball, the boot of the Sporting player behind Kane is playing him ONSIDE.

And that, ladies and gentlemen, is why VAR is SHIT.

 

[oldwiltshireyid]

The Woolwich unravel has began. As PSV have shown , get at them and they’re shit
Oops sorry , wrong thread

 

[Gilded Lily]

Didn’t see you guys last night unfortunately.

Popped along to the shelf bar but ended up closer to the bar than gate 122.

It was noticeable how busy that place is with the guy singing his songs. As soon as he stopped everybody left!!

I swung by too but wasn’t sure what/who I was looking for. Think we need some kind of secret salute…

 

[bunburyist]

That's why Skipp needs to be given more game time. He knows what to do with the ball and has a natural attacking instinct.

There where times yesterday - and Dier, Hojbjerg and Bentancur where the worst offenders - when what a 20m space would open up in front of them and they would just dawdle…..panic and sideways pass.

It’s probably the most basic rule of football, get the fucking ball up the pitch. The moment they started moving forwards, esp once Gil came on, Sporting would immediately on the back foot and struggling.

That was a game we could have won 4-1 but we conspired to draw. Still pissed off about it.

Enjoyed the ‘one of our own’ pints though, grown on me