Poch out?

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Poch out?

  • Yes

    Votes: 161 36.9%
  • No

    Votes: 275 63.1%

  • Total voters
    436
Who employed the man who picks cunts every week?

Do you think it was a mistake to employ Pochettino?

Or is the mistake not sacking him already ?

If you don't think either are mistakes then why not just criticise Levy for the mistakes he makes and criticise Pochettino for the mistakes he makes?

For example, I don't think Lvey should have abandoned the DOF system, he shouldn’t have given Poch more say in recruitment than he already had, he shouldn’t have dismantled our scouting/analytics dept, he shouldn’t have let Ian Graham (the guy in charge of Liverpool’s recruitment analytics) go, he shouldn’t have given Sherwood the behind the scenes authority he did - which I think led to one of the best youth coaches in Alex Inglethorpe going.

As a result of some of these errors our recruitment became less effective, we have struggled to get non hg players off the payroll, meaning we have struggled to create space to recruit. We have a bunch of important senior players who’s contracts have been allowed to run down, creating a kind funk in the dressing room.

Pochettino demanded more control in recruitment, and Pochettino has made poor choices whilst having a greater say in recruitment.

Pochettino has continually made poor selection and tactical choices, as a result performances have suffered massively, as have results.

Pochettino has wasted years of academy development of certain players. Happy to tolerate sub standard performance from senior players, in some cases players whose purchase he sanctioned, whilst being intolerant of others, including certain academy players.

In a nutshell, lets criticise Levy for what we think he gets wrong, that's within his remit, lets criticise Poch for what's within his remit. Sometimes there will be overlaps of culpability - such as the whole DOF/Recruitment thing.
 
For me it’s just a mix of things. Contract issues, injuries, three different home stadiums, an ageing squad in a tactical system designed for youthful players, unhelpful comments from Pochettino, changes to the wage structure, and perhaps most significantly, the psychological effect of losing the CL final.

I think that last point has hit Pochettino and the players hard. They got within touching distance of the ultimate prize in club football. Pochettino probably thought it was destiny. After all the talk about the players having ‘big balls’ in the QF and SF, it’s probably all very awkward after their castrated performance in the final.

I still think we should stick by him. This is going to be a transitional season whether under him or a new manager, so we might as well give him the chance to work with the new signings.
 
For me it’s just a mix of things. Contract issues, injuries, three different home stadiums, an ageing squad in a tactical system designed for youthful players, unhelpful comments from Pochettino, changes to the wage structure, and perhaps most significantly, the psychological effect of losing the CL final.

I think that last point has hit Pochettino and the players hard. They got within touching distance of the ultimate prize in club football. Pochettino probably thought it was destiny. After all the talk about the players having ‘big balls’ in the QF and SF, it’s probably all very awkward after their castrated performance in the final.

I still think we should stick by him. This is going to be a transitional season whether under him or a new manager, so we might as well give him the chance to work with the new signings.

When Liverpool lost to RM in the UCL Final they went out and improved their squad by addressing their biggest weakness with a world class player at that position (Alisson). We didn’t go that.
 
For me the question comes down to this. After everything we've achieved in the last 5 years, have we earned a spot at the top table? Are we a big club now? Or are we still plucky little Tottenham who have no business being in a CL final and should be happy just to be hovering around Woolwich.

If it's the former then changing the manager in these circumstances is perfectly logical and acceptable, you could not lose the way we lost the last 2 games, after 9 months of horrible form and a CL final defeat, and expect to survive. A pink slip would have been delivered in the tunnel after the final whistle at Brighton. Big clubs cannot accept prolonged periods of bad results and performances combined with constant obnoxious media statements from the manager.

If you see us as just "lads, it's Tottenham" then I understand why you'd be hesitant to sack Poch, he's achieved his mission of taking us into the top 4 while the stadium was being built and exceeded his mission objective by reaching the CL final. You might think that this is as good as it could ever get for us in this world of blood money clubs, in which case keeping the guy who brought us this far seems like the best way to guarantee we stay at this level.

Personally I feel that, prior to this season, we had shown the world that we were a top team and that we belonged with the big boys. I won't accept keeping Poch if it means a continuation of this form until January when we can have a clear-out. The players we have are better than what they are showing and the manager needs to find a way to get results NOW. If he can't do that then it's time to go. Massive credit to Poch for taking us up the football ladder in the last 5 years but as good a job as he has done, this is still Tottenham Hotspur and not Pochettino FC. What matters is that Tottenham win games, not that we indulge the manager. Managers come and go.

The first thing Poch has always said when we lose games or don't win finals is that people don't "understand our project" that you cannot "compare Tottenham with another club". I.e. we should be thankful that we are where we are and not get too excited. Well that might have passed muster in 14/15 but we are in the 19/20 season now and just played a CL final. That phase of the project is over, he got us where we needed to go. The next phase involves winning enough games to challenge Liverpool, not losing almost every away game for an entire year.
 
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Poch to the players.
 
Must be the 5th game in a row Ive thought that now.....surely a shit show tonight cannot possibly give him the right to take us to Anfield though

Bill Madrid Bill Madrid
Look Bill, I just said I want Liverpool to beat us again
But you can't wait for the massacre at Anfield Sammy, you want us to fail, you said so.

You don't say it in as many words but it's clear don't want us to win tonight either.

You're about as Tottenham as the lovechild of Bertie Mee and Charlie George, conceived in the ruins of Dial Square

You won't be happy until you are finally installed as the new Spurs manager, allowing you to play your dream XI

np9beqf.png
 
I think he's on his last legs now. Not being funny but there's no energy, no teamwork, the movement and desire off the ball is shocking and he's stayed too loyal to wasters and not given enough of the promising ones enough of a chance.

We've become too predictable, I think it's getting to the point where he's been found out. I saw no shouting, no getting the boys up for it he's a shell of his former self and ultimately the sword falls on him if it were to fall on anyone. It's a shame but his outspoken moments have really soured it for me and I think the team.

I can't see any light at the end of the tunnel on this one. The same 60 minute subs, the same languid, arrogant passing waiting for the goal to come instead of making it come, it's just turned a bit shit really hasn't it?
 
This place is toxic. The only thing worse than the players attitude are the noise from the "fans" (melters). Try backing your team instead!

I’m guessing you go to enough games to know we have been poor for a long time.

Got lucky in the CL semi and Poch makes noises about leaving. Rather than saying this is the beginning of something.
Then pre season he re-iterates he would have left.

He really did himself no favours at all with that.

Last night said he might manage Madrid one day.


Yet we are the ones not showing loyalty. Yeah righto.

I only have one season ticket. And I’m not planning on swapping it for one in Madrid.
 
I believe its what he wanted since the CL final, and he naively thought we´d win so he had the perfect stage to walk out on.
Seems like that defeat had consequences far beyond what we imagined and he lost focus and trust among the squad.
And we´re supposed to still be celebrating that night..
To ask for another two transfer windows to sort things out with the squad we already have is taking the piss. It also does nothing to motivate the current players if they feel Poch wants such a massive rebuild. Losing last night and watching his team selection (Wanyama particularly) and response to how the match was going in relation to subs was both gutting and baffling.
 
When Poch came, he had a young squad which he managed to get to respect each other and to pull in the same direction. He instilled a clear off-the-pitch and on-the-pitch philosophy and a way of playing that at that time was quite extraordinary in the PL. He got the players to pull together and he got the very best out of most of them.

The squad was fresh, energetic, young and eager. We played aggressive, fantastic, offensive football. Somewhat naive, perhaps, against the big clubs, but it provided mostly very good results.

I think our downfall came partly from our too early success, partly from our lack of new blood, and partly from our attempts to eliminate the naivety.

Our good results were well deserved. They came from excellent collective and individual performances. The football we played, and the work by Poch and his staff with the players, made most of our lads play as if they were among the very best in the world intheir positions. That, in turn, gave them and us expectations. Many of our players, we know, started dreaming of greener pastures: It started with Rose, Walker and Alderweireld, as far as I know, but also spread to Eriksen and probably others. Poch has struggled to handle the egos - which is to be expected in a "smaller club", with less exposure and, more importantly, a smaller wage budget.

Additionally, the success came at a cost in terms of exposure, pressure, and wear. We all remember the fun bromance that we got to witness from Dele and Dier in Dele's first, very impressive season. Bigger, smarter clubs would, or at least should, protect their young, inexperienced stars from media exposure. We threw Dele and Dier head first into the limelight. I believe they have both suffered from it since, and that the over-exposure is part of the reason they have both declined as footballers ever since.

However, the wear may have been an even more important factor. Our young squad has been rather small - or at least it has appeared to be when looking at how our first eleven has been rushed back from injuries and been very rarely rested. Additionally, due to our and their success, many of them have become crucial players for their national teams, and went on to bring their national teams success in the latest world cup, which have caused additional wear not matched by any other club in the world.

Whether it be the result of handling the players with regards to fatigue, or a result of changes to deal with the naivety of our early Poch era high press, our approach to football has changed over the last few years.

I think it was in 17/18 that I first clearly recognised us park the bus and counter in the CL against Real Madrid. It provided us some great results. However, it looked to me as success at a great cost. It looked apparent that we had worked on adding that approach to our game, to give us another way to win games - a plan B. A lot of fans wanted us to become better against the big teams and to develop a game plan that would be efficient against the giants, a desire probably matched by Poch and his boys. That, however, clearly diminishes the strength and efficiency of our plan A.

We have also seen a result of the desire to have other ways of playing in our player transfers. We've bought fast, tricky wingers, and we've bought big, strong attackers. We've included midfielders with a passing game, unable to really dominate the middle of the park.

This has led to us being able to grind out some results, to steal a few points here and there, and even to reach a Champions League final. Was it for the best, though?

In my opinion, clearly no. Instead of getting players in with other skillsets to provide alternatives to our first eleven, we should have gone for players who could fill the roles of our first eleven. Backup instead of alternatives. Players to challenge, instead of players to be used if we needed another game plan.

We should have perfected our style of football, instead of developing four different, semi-efficient styles and strategies. It seems to be a commonly accepted idea, that teams need to know how to play different styles, different formations, to match up to and beat different opponents. Sure, I can agree that sometimes a gameplan may need some tweaks to get a result. But who are the most succesful? Generally, the most succesful are the teams that have a clear approach to the game, a way ofplaying that they just do so well that they make themselves very hard to stop.

Look at Liverpool and City, at Barca under Guardiola, and at certain lesser clubs like Burnley. They focus on playing their style of football, and they let their opponents have to deal with that. That is what we did under Poch up until the summer of '17 (mostly). That allowed our players to get comfortable in and clearly know their role.

Now, our game plan is far less consistent, as is our quality of football (which often feels non-existant). Our players, suffering from fatigue, and over-exposure over time, also suffers from having to deal with inconsistent game plans.

I do believe in Poch, I like Poch, but he has to get back his energy, his confidence and his original one game plan. We need to be Spurs - a team that others have to deal with, that will come at you - not just another clubs that adapts to get a result.

We need to get rid of the bad apples and start fresh. With OUR style of attractive football. The transition will be tough, we, as fans, need to support our management through it.
 
I like Balague but he's talking complete and utter nonsense in this article:

"In his first years the system used most often was 3-4-3 or a 4-4-2 with offensive full-backs and mobile forwards, but it suddenly became clear to Pochettino and his team last season that their squad possessed an abundance of defensive players and so they began to play five at the back. That stops that pressure high up the pitch as the number of players up front is reduced".

WHAT THE FUCK is he on about!?!
 
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