The East End itch Levy can't quite scratch....

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I nearly shat my pants this morning when one of the guys at work told me it had fallen through... It's nearly winter and fuck protesting down the high road in winter.

Then I realised that West Ham are going to rent it instead and felt a lot better.

So Levy is a genius etc... However where does this leave us with the leverage we had with Boris?

I just want to know if it's worth me signing up my 3 months old boy for season ticket, because by the time I get one I'll be wearing a wooden overcoat.
 
Benjoss said:
I nearly shat my pants this morning when one of the guys at work told me it had fallen through... It's nearly winter and fuck protesting down the high road in winter.

Then I realised that West Ham are going to rent it instead and felt a lot better.

So Levy is a genius etc... However where does this leave us with the leverage we had with Boris?

I just want to know if it's worth me signing up 3 month old boy for season ticket, because by the time I get one I'll be wearing a wooden overcoat.
that made me laugh a lot more than it should have! :laugh:
 
Thought it was Flav, he's been far more vociforous about Stratford than most.

Plus Trunk doesn't seem to have 'ranting' as part of his repetoire, unless it's about wotsits.
 
Whats the difference between West Ham renting and Man City renting? Doesn't seem to have harmed City in any way at all.

This close to Docklands that place is a cash cow.

Not Pro-Stratford in any way - but I could always see what Levy was trying to achieve by moving the club there.

To prove a point where is the "loyal support" for the Rubin Kazan game? Levy knows we are all glory hunters at heart.

But I'm a mug anyway - took 6 people to the Woolwich game in the CC last year. Most money I will ever spend on a reserve game I hope.
 
Arms Dealer said:
spooky said:
Wondering what all the pro-Stratford folk think of this mess...

Really? Good luck with that, Trunk's rant in the Podcast was hardly conducive to debate

That was I, rather than Trunk.

Debate is welcome, I just get my way mostly.

That's what happens when you're the bollocks like me.
 
SpursUltra said:
Whats the difference between West Ham renting and Man City renting? Doesn't seem to have harmed City in any way at all.

This close to Docklands that place is a cash cow.

Not Pro-Stratford in any way - but I could always see what Levy was trying to achieve by moving the club there.

To prove a point where is the "loyal support" for the Rubin Kazan game? Levy knows we are all glory hunters at heart.

But I'm a mug anyway - took 6 people to the a***nal game in the CC last year. Most money I will ever spend on a reserve game I hope.

One of the worst games of my life. Utterly horrible.
 
I was in the Shelf and looking down at them going absolutely mental and singing the nanananana Samir Nasri (which we then nicked) was horrible. I just sat there with my head in my hands. I wanted Redknapp to put a full strength side out so badly, instead I got to bear witness to an actual rape.
 
Flav said:
Arms Dealer said:
spooky said:
Wondering what all the pro-Stratford folk think of this mess...

Really? Good luck with that, Trunk's rant in the Podcast was hardly conducive to debate

That was I, rather than Trunk.

Debate is welcome, I just get my way mostly.

That's what happens when you're the bollocks like me.
the decor at your gaff would suggest otherwise...................... :whistle:
 
mdiver said:
Arms Dealer said:
spooky said:
Wondering what all the pro-Stratford folk think of this mess...

Really? Good luck with that, Trunk's rant in the Podcast was hardly conducive to debate

Nothing to debate, we are Tottenham, not Stratford.

It just amazes me how many people are posting that Levy took up this legal challenge because it in some way held back West Ham. If we had won the bid in the first instance, Levy would be moving us to Stratford no matter what "We are N17" or anyone else said. And you can bet match day 1 would be a sell out.

The majority of posters here are trying to discern Levy's motives by thinking like fans instead of as the chairman. The chairman of an investment company in fact. A bigger stadium, at a cheaper cost, in a developing area with better transport links. What's not to like from a businessman's point of view? In taking up this legal challenge I am convinced he hoped to knock out West Ham's bid and present Tottenham as the only viable bidder (especially from a tax payers point of you). In short, he still wanted it.

The "debate" is where do we go from here. Because we're not going to rent the Olympic Stadium. And no matter how much fans trumpet the NDP, I get the impression Levy just doesn't think a 56,250 seat stadium is big enough and doesn't particularly love the idea of carrying the burden for the improvement of the area. Otherwise he would have accepted Boris' pay off and moved on. There's probably a lot of blank looks and shrugging going on in the boardroom.
 
Think it was Flav who ranted.

We can sit down and debate fiscal reasons all day long, but its West Ham's territory not ours and we had no valid reason to go searching for a new home there. I guess the thinking is that in 20 years time having moved to Stratford and playing consistent CL football, fans wont be complaining about moving to East London and our past will be just that. Might sit well with some to see a club up rooted to another part of London, but it doesn't with me.

Levy runs an investment company, so I do get he would have no qualms about moving there to maximise profit in the short term to sell the club on and appease shareholders. And whilst he fights the government he also knows he can still win out for the NDP (although why we need to ask money to improve the local area when the local area is light years behind other places in London is beyond me, but I guess its fucking poor borough that we have our club sitting in).

Tottenham is Tottenham, that's it. Don't care for these 'new chapter' arguments. If we move to East London the clubs personality and characteristics will change. Sure, we'll have our history, but this is not about the past its about the future and we'll turn into a completely alien club to what we have now.

If we had not been awarded the Olympics, what would we be doing as a club re: a new ground?

Let me guess. Move to the Midlands so we can attract fans from all over the country.
 
spooky said:
but I guess its fucking poor borough that we have our club sitting in

Apologies it was Flav in Podcast 8, decent rant that.

Anyway the point you make above is the valid point. Our great club is located in a shithole. No fiscal debate required. A lot of fans support Tottenham in spite of the area we are located and the 25 minute boot from Seven Sisters (or the parking). When I talk about Tottenham I don't talk about my pride in the area, I talk about the pride in the eleven players on the pitch. I love the shirt not the area, and the two can be exclusive. Maybe its because I'm not from Tottenham, but I'm a season ticket holder and you can't just dismiss the views of fans who don't hold romantic notions of Haringey.

Players change, stands get rebuilt, pubs get burned down and some stadiums get moved (East London does not inconvenience the existing fanbase like a move to the Midlands would). The team in white is the constant that matters.

I was at the Bernabeu, the San Siro, hell even Woolwich away. I remember thinking that teams that come to us in the Champions League must be decidedly unimpressed. That goes for new signings. I want bigger and better for my club (and not in a quick-fix Man City style). If that was judged to be Stratford so be it, if its the NDP so much the better.

Your point about turning into an alien club or invasion of territory (really Spook, are you in the firm?) suggest a frightened-of-change mentality than an argument for the NDP.
 
What is Tottenham Hotspur?

Its difficult to talk about this question because you can sit and attempt to quantify what constitutes emotional detachment and what defines a club and what it means in practicality for hours and still not get anywhere when attempting to use said arguments in relation to a potential move away from N17.

So what is Tottenham? Is it the fans? The area? Do you define a club by its traditions and if so, what are traditions? Style of play, memories of games? Players? Celebrations? Infamous away trips? Hatred for other clubs? So much goes into constructing the DNA of a supporter and club. I think its all of the above, all mashed together in a sexy gooey kinda way.

Football is emotive, so surely it should be based on emotions?

What? Oh yeah, PLC. I need to remember to get a tattoo of that on my back.

If we moved down the road, say to another part of North London, there would be a transitional period for all of us attempting to move on from the fact we've left WHL. It happens in life when you move jobs, split up with your woman or someone dies. You think its all gone, its all changed, but you adapt and you end up embracing the present and move onto the future.

No matter where we play, you could argue, Spurs exist because they exist in our heads and in our minds. If there were no Spurs fans they'd be no club. Now before I drown in deeply philosophical nonsense that I'm struggling to articulate because I'm sober...what I'm saying is, I do get that history DOES count and everything this club has achieved will not suddenly disappear because we've shifted home. Or will it?

Spurs won the double in 61. Eight FA Cups. Trophies in Europe. I could name 50 flair players off the top of my head that made their mark for our club. These are the things we can't lose because what has happened can never be changed, but the clubs actual physical persona, its character and its appearance will forever morph into something completely different. And why? Because at that moment in time Stratford was more affordable and feasible than N17.

Revenue, 60K + attendances, new supporters, corporate hospitality to die for, transport links made in heaven...all this has nothing to do with what happens on the pitch when Spurs play. I'm talking in the purest sense here. If it takes another 10 years to get the NDP sorted I'd rather wait then spend another 100 years in N17 than to up root and move to another part of London just because it's a more fiscal do-able option in the short term.

Why the mad rush? Football might well implode in the next 10 years, we don't know. The mad rush is because shareholders demand it. And okay, billionaires are buying up clubs left right and centre and changing competition and the landscape of competitiveness. Again, rather be this plucky side on the outskirts punching our way in. And if we get in, and we enjoy a cycle of success and then lose that cycle. So be it. That's football. Nobody is at the top forever. We've not quite been at the top for a long long time.

Comes back to what you define as heritage and would constitutes an acceptable sacrifice (i.e. leaving North London to settle in East London).

The club would have moved had they won the bid. That's the scary thing. The power of custodians over the voice of the dispensable fan.

We are Tottenham, small club they say, yet we always compete or at least show ambition to and the last 15 years has been down to bad management on the pitch (and off) in terms of managerial appointments. We still make money, we still splash said money. And look at us now, with the monopoly practically dead, we are always in with a chance.

We need a bigger ground, not because I'm concerned about the £££ but because we have loyal hardcore fans who want season tickets and they are much needed because 50k make more noise than 37K. The extra revenue will obviously help to bolster the rich and spoilt millionaires that wear the shirt with a fraction of the loyalty we possess.

I probably still haven't got my point across in the best way, but I guess what I want, what I need as a fan is different to how others perceive things. Some are simply focused on the fact that a bigger stadium, more money will somehow guarantee success and glory. Might. Might not.

I do think we need to be ambitious. But want us to anchor ourselves to some of that intangible emotive stuff that glues as together.

You know, from my front door, Stratford is 30 minutes away by tube (and I don't even live in London). But rather spend 1 hour + getting into that shit hole in North London :)
 
Flav said:
Arms Dealer said:
spooky said:
Wondering what all the pro-Stratford folk think of this mess...

Really? Good luck with that, Trunk's rant in the Podcast was hardly conducive to debate

That was I, rather than Trunk.

Debate is welcome, I just get my way mostly.

That's what happens when you're the bollocks like me.

To quote your good self -

"as long as Tottenham Hotspur football club exists I will belong"

but only if they stay where they are yes ? fickle cunt.
 
The whole Viable line summed it all up.

The NDP is/was viable. However when it looked like West Ham could get a stadium in London near to the City for next to nothing Levy must have wondered what the hell was going on and then thought "why not?"
Attracting the corporate to WHL is going to be a problem anyway, even more so if West Ham are a 10 minute journey away in the world famous Olympic Stadium (renamed).

From a business point of view it made sense, but as Spooky said above it would change the DNA of the football club forever.

I want us to stay in WHL, but at the same time had we of moved I was not in the camp that would never watch Spurs again. I can understand people who felt that way just not sure I could write Spurs out of my life. Maybe I would have gone for 1 season thought this is shit and not renewed my ST, happily I will never know.

If we develop the existing stadium location I am in no doubt the atmosphere will change, we already seem to be a lot quieter most games. A load of tourists coming through the doors would be needed for the less glamorous games in particular.

Man City went to General sale this year, Villa is currently on General Sale. Do we need 20k more seats? Is the recession to blame along with high ticket prices? It's a tough one for Levy, which is probably why he is intent on squeezing money from the government, but I am still unconvinced a 56k stadium will sell out that frequently, especially if we are not in the CL it would seem.

Well not unless ticket prices come down, which with a higher level of debt I doubt will happen. All depends on the corporate sales...............prawn sandwich anyone?
 
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