Tottenham Hotspur vs Liverpool, 28/01, 8PM KO

[scarletjim]

Jose wanted Dier
Jose gave Toby a new contract
Jose signed Rodon
Jose signed Doherty
Jose cried that our whole tactics had to change when Davies was injured

Aurier managed to become PSGs RB. He's bossed for us in many games against top 6 teams and in the CL. Wasn't he great against Pool away this season too?

Sanchez when being coached well was fine alongside a more experienced head. He even got to a Europa final with Ajax.

So you're saying Jose needs better players. But also that he signs shit ones. And since we know Jose wants to control who comes in the solution is give him lots of money lol?

So because Jose likes / signed Dier, Toby, Rodon and Doherty that means they have absolutely no responsibility for what they do on the field? So in your view whenever a team fails it is 100% on the manager, all the players are what they are and never professed to be anything more, so it's all the manager's fault for signing / liking / selecting them? Come on, you can't possibly have such a narrow-minded view surely?

You seem to have this misconception that I believe Jose is some kind of god who can do no wrong - if so then I've no idea where you got it from, because having just re-read all my previous posts on this thread, I have postulated in every single one of them the possibility that Jose is ultimately to blame for the failure of our defenders. Did you read those parts?

The difference between us appears to be that I can accept numerous possibilities for our regular defensive individual errors, where as you appear to be unable to do so, having decided that there is one cause and closed your mind to any other possibilities. Just because you have a theory, it doesn't necessarily mean that you are right. Even if you believe in your theory, you should accept that other (less likely in your mind) causes could possibly be valid. And by the way, ending each post with a ridiculous statement followed by a 'lol' doesn't make what goes before it any more valid or definitively correct.

Perhaps we agree that I am open to the possibility that there could be numerous different reasons for our regular individual defensive errors, and you are not, having confirmed for certain in your mind the one and only cause? That would be an appropriate 'settlement' for me (always happy to disagree but equally always eager to find the fundamental point on which we disagree ). We're all Spurs at the end of the day, and of course we are all entitled to our opinions.

 

[Team Tanguy]

So because Jose likes / signed Dier, Toby, Rodon and Doherty that means they have absolutely no responsibility for what they do on the field? So in your view whenever a team fails it is 100% on the manager, all the players are what they are and never professed to be anything more, so it's all the manager's fault for signing / liking / selecting them? Come on, you can't possibly have such a narrow-minded view surely?

You seem to have this misconception that I believe Jose is some kind of god who can do no wrong - if so then I've no idea where you got it from, because having just re-read all my previous posts on this thread, I have postulated in every single one of them the possibility that Jose is ultimately to blame for the failure of our defenders. Did you read those parts?

The difference between us appears to be that I can accept numerous possibilities for our regular defensive individual errors, where as you appear to be unable to do so, having decided that there is one cause and closed your mind to any other possibilities. Just because you have a theory, it doesn't necessarily mean that you are right. Even if you believe in your theory, you should accept that other (less likely in your mind) causes could possibly be valid. And by the way, ending each post with a ridiculous statement followed by a 'lol' doesn't make what goes before it any more valid or definitively correct.

Perhaps we agree that I am open to the possibility that there could be numerous different reasons for our regular individual defensive errors, and you are not, having confirmed for certain in your mind the one and only cause? That would be an appropriate 'settlement' for me (always happy to disagree but equally always eager to find the fundamental point on which we disagree ). We're all Spurs at the end of the day, and of course we are all entitled to our opinions.

We have exhausted ourselves.
My final closing statement:
We added 9 players to a squad that got top 4 and a CL final. It's good enough to do much, much better, it's on the manager. Mistakes happen, but when it's constant you can't blame the players.

We shall agree to disagree pal

 

[peter merison]

Our players are good but very inconsistent and its not often enough all of the 11 play well at the same time , its very roller coaster.
Everton, Woolwich,Chelsea are all in the same boat this year

 

[scarletjim]

We have exhausted ourselves.
My final closing statement:
We added 9 players to a squad that got top 4 and a CL final. It's good enough to do much, much better, it's on the manager. Mistakes happen, but when it's constant you can't blame the players.

We shall agree to disagree pal

Some of that successful side has regressed. Jan is gone, Toby is not the player he once was, neither is Dele (and neither has he been for a long time). The same side that was in the CL final barely played a good game in the league in that calendar year, and was atrocious for months before Poch was (admittedly sadly) fired.

But fair enough - so, my closing statement:
For me it's nonsensical to suggest that "it's on the manager" 100% and the players have no responsibility. It's a team game. Mourinho must have some of the blame, and the players must have some of the blame. Quite where the ratio between the two lies is absolutely a matter of very subjective opinion, but imho to absolve the players from all responsibility is utter madness.

Always happy to agree to disagree, particularly when it's on good terms. Hopefully we're together on one thing - whether it's Mourinho, the players, or a combination of both, hopefully we both hope to the bottom of out hearts that they turn it around, win tomorrow, win a trophy, and qualify for the CL, ideally via the league.

COYS!

 

[daveyboy88]

We have exhausted ourselves.
My final closing statement:
We added 9 players to a squad that got top 4 and a CL final. It's good enough to do much, much better, it's on the manager. Mistakes happen, but when it's constant you can't blame the players.

We shall agree to disagree pal

dier, aurier, sanchez, sissoko, winks and dele was shit before jose came. nothing has changed, in actual fact hes actually improved dier and aurier but they are still shite.

and up until a few weeks ago kane and son was having the seasons of their careers

 

[Kiwi]

Has any one said the crosses between lloris and deir were actually perfect?

 

[1882]

4,994 likes

They MUST have been looking at the same line markings as Roy Carroll used!

That STILL fucking hurts!! VAR wouold have exploded with that decision !! (Bet they still woulda found a way NOT to give it.... cos it was US!)

 

[Château NoHo]

LOL

We score goals because Kane and Son started the season in unprecedented form, breaking records and yet still even with that incredible play we are close to the top not at the top. Our attack is based solely on those two having individual brilliance so they can make up for our defensive tactics.
Ignoring this is just flat out stupid, It isn't my opinion it is fact.

The only thing unprecedented is Kane + Son's partnership, not our offensive OR defensive record.

SEASON	GF:GA	+/-	PLACE	PTS	PTS from 1st
20/21	34:20	+14	6th	33	11	match in hand on 1-5
19/20	34:27	+7	6th	29	26
18/19	42:18	+24	2nd	45	6
17/18	34:18	+16	5th	34	19
16/17	37:14	+23	4th	39	10
15/16	33:15	+18	4th	35	4

If's and maybe's are great but they don't change what is fact. 1 point from 4th isn't impressive, 8 points from 1st isn't impressive either and that is with your if's and maybe's.

Continue to go along with your head in the sand looking at meaningless tables and ignoring what is actually happening on the field. Unfortunately for you, you ignoring reality doesn't change the actual only table that matters, the one you want to ignore.

Lol. You haven't the foggiest clue what's actually happening on the field, just like you haven't the foggiest clue about what the word "fact" means, or how to support an argument.

 

[Igula]

The only thing unprecedented is Kane + Son's partnership, not our offensive OR defensive record.

SEASON	GF:GA	+/-	PLACE	PTS	PTS from 1st
20/21	34:20	+14	6th	33	11	match in hand on 1-5
19/20	34:27	+7	6th	29	26
18/19	42:18	+24	2nd	45	6
17/18	34:18	+16	5th	34	19
16/17	37:14	+23	4th	39	10
15/16	33:15	+18	4th	35	4

Lol. You haven't the foggiest clue what's actually happening on the field, just like you haven't the foggiest clue about what the word "fact" means, or how to support an argument.

I said the Kane/Son partnership is unprecedented and you refute that by posting a table showing that I am right? Ok.

And it is clear what is going on the field, which is why everyone can see and talks about it, we struggle to score if Kane and Son don't create something on their own. This is not a controversial opinion it is widely agreed on by people that don't have a stupid agenda like yourself.

It is also true that this hasn't been an impressive season for us so far both in terms of style of play and results on the field, again not debatable or a controversial fact.

 

[Château NoHo]

I said the Kane/Son partnership is unprecedented and you refute that by posting a table showing that I am right? Ok.

You said "we score goals because Kane and Son started the season in unprecedented form, breaking records." The only thing unprecedented is Kane's assists this season. We've scored the same amount of goals (at this point in the season) as every other season since Poch, save our "unprecedented" 18/19 season.

And it is clear what is going on the field, which is why everyone can see and talks about it, we struggle to score if Kane and Son don't create something on their own. This is not a controversial opinion it is widely agreed on by people that don't have a stupid agenda like yourself.

You're really going out on a limb saying that we struggle to score if our top two goal scorers don't score. Incredible insight. Next thing you're gonna tell us that Liverpool would struggle without Salah and Mane.

My only agenda is against insufferable moaning fartknockers like yourself.

It is also true that this hasn't been an impressive season for us so far both in terms of style of play and results on the field, again not debatable or a controversial fact.

It's not true. It's not a fact. It's your opinion. You literally (not figuratively, literally) do not understand the difference between a fact and an opinion.

 

[Igula]

You said "we score goals because Kane and Son started the season in unprecedented form, breaking records." The only thing unprecedented is Kane's assists this season. We've scored the same amount of goals (at this point in the season) as every other season since Poch, save our "unprecedented" 18/19 season.

You're really going out on a limb saying that we struggle to score if our top two goal scorers don't score. Incredible insight. Next thing you're gonna tell us that Liverpool would struggle without Salah and Mane.

My only agenda is against insufferable moaning fartknockers like yourself.

It's not true. It's not a fact. It's your opinion. You literally (not figuratively, literally) do not understand the difference between a fact and an opinion.

Yes Kane and Son tying the record that was set 30 years ago is an unprecedented start and instead of taking advantage of that all we can do is match our usual output, that is terrible. With a start like that from those two we should be way above our usual output. That kind of output is highly unlikely to be kept up all season so its concerning that when we get it we didn't do better.

Liverpool has shown it can score when those two aren't on top of their game. They have an attack that is not based on get the ball to Saleh and Mane and hope they can do it all on their own.

Oh no it is a fact. Read the form, read the media.

If you think that the style we play or 6th in the table is anywhere close to good enough then you are even more delusional than I thought.

 

[Château NoHo]

Yes Kane and Son tying the record that was set 30 years ago is an unprecedented start and instead of taking advantage of that all we can do is match our usual output, that is terrible. With a start like that from those two we should be way above our usual output. That kind of output is highly unlikely to be kept up all season so its concerning that when we get it we didn't do better.

Kane on pace for 24 goals.
Kane has met/exceeded that every season (except 14/15) where he's played at least 30 matches.
Son has yet to show he can be a league-leading goal scorer.

Liverpool has shown it can score when those two aren't on top of their game. They have an attack that is not based on get the ball to Saleh and Mane and hope they can do it all on their own.

Oh no it is a fact. Read the form, read the media.

If you think that the style we play or 6th in the table is anywhere close to good enough then you are even more delusional than I thought.

Again, not a fact.

Your boy Aurier has more PL goals this season than every Liverpool player except for (their front 3 rotation of) Salah, Mane, Firmino and Jota.

 

[Igula]

Kane on pace for 24 goals.
Kane has met/exceeded that every season (except 14/15) where he's played at least 30 matches.
Son has yet to show he can be a league-leading goal scorer.

Again, not a fact.

Your boy Aurier has more PL goals this season than every Liverpool player except for (their front 3 rotation of) Salah, Mane, Firmino and Jota.

Great you said Mane and Saleh so awesome that you now include two other guides and they seem to be doing something right considering they have a CL title, PL title and are ahead of us in the table.

 

[Château NoHo]

Great you said Mane and Saleh so awesome that you now include two other guides and they seem to be doing something right considering they have a CL title, PL title and are ahead of us in the table.

Here are some facts for ya:
Liverpool have 6 CL titles. They also have (nearly) double Spurs budget.
One of those other two guides (Jota) hasn't won shit.
Liverpool 2.000 GF/match, 1.150 GA/match
Spurs 1.789 GF/match, 1.053 GA/match

 

[Igula]

Here are some facts for ya:
Liverpool have 6 CL titles. They also have (nearly) double Spurs budget.
One of those other two guides (Jota) hasn't won shit.
Liverpool 2.000 GF/match, 1.150 GA/match
Spurs 1.789 GF/match, 1.053 GA/match

Great that all has nothing to do with the fact that we are in 6th now, finished 6th last year and are playing the worst football the team has seen in the past 8 years if not longer.

Poch was able to consistently get us to the top 4 with all those above factors, Harry got us to top 4 with Liverpool having all those great advantages.

Jose isn't living up to the standards of the guys who did it here before him with less, so whining about Liverpools budget rings pretty hollow.

 

[Château NoHo]

Great that all has nothing to do with the fact that we are in 6th now, finished 6th last year and are playing the worst football the team has seen in the past 8 years if not longer.

Poch was able to consistently get us to the top 4 with all those above factors, Harry got us to top 4 with Liverpool having all those great advantages.

Jose isn't living up to the standards of the guys who did it here before him with less, so whining about Liverpools budget rings pretty hollow.

Form table Premier League 19/20 Matchweeks 13-38.
Mourinho came in last season matchweek 13 (3-2 win @ Spam).
The standard he inherited from his predecessor was 14th place.
Already in a cup final, and still active in all campaigns this season.
2-0-0 vs Woolwich.
Win tomorrow and we're 5th, 1 point from 4th, despite some ridiculous decisions.

Cheer up, Igula-baby.

 

[Igula]

Form table Premier League 19/20 Matchweeks 13-38.
Mourinho came in last season matchweek 13 (3-2 win @ Spam).
The standard he inherited from his predecessor was 14th place.
Already in a cup final, and still active in all campaigns this season.
2-0-0 vs Woolwich.
Win tomorrow and we're 5th, 1 point from 4th, despite some ridiculous decisions.

Cheer up, Igula-baby.

He came in we were within 3-6 points of 4th so no it was not some big deal to get top 4 when he came in. He had chances for us to win and get into the top 4 and failed badly each time.

We could have beat errorless Bournemouth and Sheffield United teams and got into the top 4 with the extra points but couldn’t do that.

The 14th place nonsense is not a valid excuse at all. Jose did not do near enough to get this team into a top 4 position despite numerous opportunities to do so.

Winning tomorrow and getting into 5th is not impressive either.

 

[Château NoHo]

He came in we were within 3-6 points of 4th so no it was not some big deal to get top 4 when he came in. He had chances for us to win and get into the top 4 and failed badly each time.

We could have beat errorless Bournemouth and Sheffield United teams and got into the top 4 with the extra points but couldn’t do that.

The 14th place nonsense is not a valid excuse at all. Jose did not do near enough to get this team into a top 4 position despite numerous opportunities to do so.

Winning tomorrow and getting into 5th is not impressive either.

Hahaha. Not impressive. Classic Igula.

 

[Igula]

Hahaha. Not impressive. Classic Igula.

How many fans do you think will be happy with a 5th place finish this year?

 

[Château NoHo]

How many fans do you think will be happy with a 5th place finish this year?

Lol. Do you want a percentage or just a sub-total? Of all fans or just Spurs fans?
Are we also counting ceiling and oscillating fans?

Also, please define "happy".