Summer 2017 transfer window or, waiting for Godot

[Guido 🇺🇦]

respect your opinion, but you cant be serious about every aspect Davies is better, trips deliver is so much better, stats are there to back it up (Tripps assist may of been against those teams, but why didnt Davies get as much then?). Its commonly known that Trips is one of the best delivery's in the league.
For Wanyama the evidence is the fact that Poch spent 11 mill on him, if thats not enough, he is also the man that took him to Southampton in the first place (where he was a key player). The fact that he purchased him twice, I very much doubt he bought him to be back-up, which was proven correct, as he started all but 2 league games.

Respect yours too.
Trippier's delivery is way over hyped, people love a cross, just as people love a corner. I hate both as they are low percentage and rarely result in anything other than lost possession. It's all he does because it's all he can do. (Some of the balls he plays are sweet, think particularly one in his England debut the other week, hit the ball first time behind the defense, beauty) but all I see is ball after ball after ball pumped into the box sailing over the heads or into the arms of a greatful keeper, whilst everyone else shouts unlucky great cross.

Walker, Rose, Davies build our attacks (the former 2 excel at it) by taking on the oppo, stretching the defense keeping wide, turning defenses, dribbling into the box, cutting the ball back, playing the short ball, the ball before the assist. They create the pressure, keeping oppo FB's pinned back as their ability on the ball enable us to keep the ball.

FWIW I think Wanyama is marginally better than Dier as a DM, they are different and each bring something to our game the other doesn't but line them up against a wall and I'll pick Wanyama first. I still maintain that no one believed he would get in ahead of Dier on the back of his season as DM that everyone was raving about, I still don't recall a single conversation about him starting ahead of Dier or Dembele. (I'd argue £11m is nothing for him, less than we paid for Davies and +£20m less them Kante, Xhaka, Schniderlin but think the money is arbitrary & not proof of importance or ability).

 

[kingdawson]

You want the new marquee signing to rotate with Dembele tho.

Then claim its defeatist to sign squad players. Yet you want to sign a squad player to play home games and against easier opponents for 40M.

You didn't answer at all. Your answer was banging on about rotation with your "new" player. That's exactly MY argument that you have been disagreeing with.

You wanted someone to improve the first team, not squad cover. Then your answer is to drop one of your favorite players, and pay 40M for someone to play home games against the likes of Huddersfield and Watford.

Sigh

You twist things something rotten and it's actually getting ridiculous. I said i would probably start Dembele against harder teams away and you've taken from that i would only start the new signing at home against easier teams like Huddersfield and Watford.

So basically ive said i would start the new marquee signing in MOST games wheras if we went the squad player option...i would start the same 11 as last season in most (if not all games). Notice there is a big difference.

 

[Dilfy]

You twist things something rotten and it's actually getting ridiculous. I said i would probably start Dembele against harder teams away and you've taken from that i would only start the new signing at home against easier teams like Huddersfield and Watford.

So basically ive said i would start the new marquee signing in MOST games wheras if we went the squad player option...i would start the same 11 as last season in most (if not all games). Notice there is a big difference.

People who think our first XI cannot be improved are like the people who in 1900 claimed humanity had invented everything possible.
Real Madrid, Juve, Bayern and Barcelona are all actively looking for players for their first eleven so so can we.

 

[Justin Edinburgh]

Anybody watching Confederation cup? That Christian Bassogog lad looks a proper winger.

No way this guy is 21 years old...

 

[Guido 🇺🇦]

Interesting read

 

[Rocket]

No way this guy is 21 years old...

Exactly what I thought about this guy...

 

[Bill Madrid]

People who think our first XI cannot be improved are like the people who in 1900 claimed humanity had invented everything possible.
Real Madrid, Juve, Bayern and Barcelona are all actively looking for players for their first eleven so so can we.

Spot on, you only have to look at Chelsea who won the league and see who they're supposedly looking to sign, ditto league winners and European Champions Real Madrid and so on.

It's been said countless times, but Fergie never rested on his laurels but sought to improve United year in, year out when they were in their pomp. As did Wenger back in the day. As did Liverpool in the 70s and 80s.

It's what big teams do

 

[Rocket]

Spot on, you only have to look at Chelsea who won the league and see who they're supposedly looking to sign, ditto league winners and European Champions Real Madrid and so on.

It's been said countless times, but Fergie never rested on his laurels but sought to improve United year in, year out when they were in their pomp. As did Wenger back in the day. As did Liverpool in the 70s and 80s.

It's what big teams do

I absolutely agree that they are all trying to improve already very good (and in some cases THE best) squads and that's what big teams do.....HOWEVER..... we are not a financially big team. The teams you are quoting all are. For one reason or another they all had/have bigger resources than us. We have punched massively above our weight for the past couple of years thanks to intelligence/luck in the transfer market, the development of youth beginning to pay off, a magic manager and an apparently sound board.

What we haven't done is join the league of the super rich who can afford to have billion pound squads AND STILL look to improve them with huge transfer fees and wages.

I for one wouldn't want to risk everything that is being built on spunking £multi millions on transfer fees for players who may or may not perform for us. The way I see it there is an element of risk in every transfer. Yes some would have a greater degree of risk than others, but then the money spent would generally reflect that. I think we're likely to stick with the policy of buying higher risk lower value players in the hope that we uncover another Dele/Eric/Toby (ok we didn't really uncover him) or develop another Harry or Harry. At least for the next 4 or 5 seasons while we are trying to establish ourselves amongst the English/European financial elite. And I for one am perfectly happy to trust them if that's what Levy and Poch decide is the right course of action. It's not done us bad over the last 3 years after all.

 

[YidDriver]

The difference between Spurs and the other sides in the league is that they've all got gaping holes in their first eleven, while we've got a near perfect team with some very nice backup players. They can and should be desperate to improve, and improvements are available to them within their resource range.

We have the luxury of not being that desperate. The only reason we get a late, big signing is probably to stop the moaning from some fans.

ha ha, the arrogance of this post!

Real Madrid/Barcelona are looking to sign players that would improve their team. And Spurs don't have to.

I have never understood signing players to improve the bench/squad. That is not productive! No matter how good you get, you should always try and sign players that can step in the starting 11 and push someone in the current 11 down. That way the overall team improves because of a better player and the replaced player now has incentive to step up his game.

Harry Kane is the darling of WHL? Great, doesn't matter! Get a striker who's going challenge him immediately to a starting place. Same with every other player in the team. No player should feel their starting place is secure.

 

[Totti]

Whilst the source is not reliable, I'd be happy if this was true. Effectively a swap with him and Bentlaleb with rumoured fees.

Would much rather spend that on Meyer then £30,000,000+ on Barkley in all honesty.

 

[spursmalc]

You seem to be arguing with yourself mate. Your second sentence is exactly my point. ???!!!??

This thread always seems to have several new pages whenever I look at it and yes some of the comments are aimed at other posts. Some comments not necessarily yours are saying we cannot improve the first 11 and players are bought as back up. I do not believe certain players are bought as back up but to play but whether they do is down to how they perform. Hence Wanyama made it and Sissoko did not yet Sissoko cost a lot more. As I said we need to name 18 players every match and on average say 2 players are injured meaning we need at least 20 players that can all play without weakening the team. We do not have that yet and thus need more players. We may never get there as there are bound to be failures. When we won the double we had the best 11 in the Country and yet broke our transfer record to buy Jimmy Greaves who replaced Les Allen. We may not be able to spend money like MC etc but need to add to the squad that play regularily to allow greater rotation in more positions. Poch ( not fans on this forum ) must decide if he can trust Sissoko, Wimmer and GKN to perform or replace them. The evidence last season was he does not trust them as he played them only rarely.

 

[tbonepremier]

People who think our first XI cannot be improved are like the people who in 1900 claimed humanity had invented everything possible.
Real Madrid, Juve, Bayern and Barcelona are all actively looking for players for their first eleven so so can we.

I think I speak for most of us "who think our first eleven can't be improved" when I say: We know. We know the top teams are looking to strengthen. Always. However, we need pretty much the same level players as they do to strengthen. Meaning we have to compete in attraction and wages with the clubs you mentioned.

I honestly can not see what GK we can realistically get that is better than Hugo, CB that is better than Jan or Toby, RB that is better than Walker, LB that is better than Rose, CM that is better than Vince or Dembele, playmaker that is better than Eriksen, "shadow striker" that is better than Alli, striker that is better than Kane, or a versatile CB/DM that is better than Dier.

 

[Mockers]

Respect yours too.
Trippier's delivery is way over hyped, people love a cross, just as people love a corner. I hate both as they are low percentage and rarely result in anything other than lost possession. It's all he does because it's all he can do. (Some of the balls he plays are sweet, think particularly one in his England debut the other week, hit the ball first time behind the defense, beauty) but all I see is ball after ball after ball pumped into the box sailing over the heads or into the arms of a greatful keeper, whilst everyone else shouts unlucky great cross.

Walker, Rose, Davies build our attacks (the former 2 excel at it) by taking on the oppo, stretching the defense keeping wide, turning defenses, dribbling into the box, cutting the ball back, playing the short ball, the ball before the assist. They create the pressure, keeping oppo FB's pinned back as their ability on the ball enable us to keep the ball.

FWIW I think Wanyama is marginally better than Dier as a DM, they are different and each bring something to our game the other doesn't but line them up against a wall and I'll pick Wanyama first. I still maintain that no one believed he would get in ahead of Dier on the back of his season as DM that everyone was raving about, I still don't recall a single conversation about him starting ahead of Dier or Dembele. (I'd argue £11m is nothing for him, less than we paid for Davies and +£20m less them Kante, Xhaka, Schniderlin but think the money is arbitrary & not proof of importance or ability).

Trippier had something like 5 assists in 5 starts last season. How is that low percentage. You really are a bore when it come to this bollocks about crossing and set pieces being a waste of time.

Trippier doesn't cross any more or less than Walker. Walker crosses just as much accept they aren't very good. Yes he might beat a player but that's invariably followed by a cross (and his crosses are low percentage).

Beckham never beat a man because he didn't need to and he made a career out of being one of the best crossers on the planet.

 

[Bill Madrid]

This thread always seems to have several new pages whenever I look at it and yes some of the comments are aimed at other posts. Some comments not necessarily yours are saying we cannot improve the first 11 and players are bought as back up. I do not believe certain players are bought as back up but to play but whether they do is down to how they perform. Hence Wanyama made it and Sissoko did not yet Sissoko cost a lot more. As I said we need to name 18 players every match and on average say 2 players are injured meaning we need at least 20 players that can all play without weakening the team. We do not have that yet and thus need more players. We may never get there as there are bound to be failures. When we won the double we had the best 11 in the Country and yet broke our transfer record to buy Jimmy Greaves who replaced Les Allen. We may not be able to spend money like MC etc but need to add to the squad that play regularily to allow greater rotation in more positions. Poch ( not fans on this forum ) must decide if he can trust Sissoko, Wimmer and GKN to perform or replace them. The evidence last season was he does not trust them as he played them only rarely.

 

[Mockers]

Respect yours too.
Trippier's delivery is way over hyped, people love a cross, just as people love a corner. I hate both as they are low percentage and rarely result in anything other than lost possession. It's all he does because it's all he can do. (Some of the balls he plays are sweet, think particularly one in his England debut the other week, hit the ball first time behind the defense, beauty) but all I see is ball after ball after ball pumped into the box sailing over the heads or into the arms of a greatful keeper, whilst everyone else shouts unlucky great cross.

Walker, Rose, Davies build our attacks (the former 2 excel at it) by taking on the oppo, stretching the defense keeping wide, turning defenses, dribbling into the box, cutting the ball back, playing the short ball, the ball before the assist. They create the pressure, keeping oppo FB's pinned back as their ability on the ball enable us to keep the ball.

FWIW I think Wanyama is marginally better than Dier as a DM, they are different and each bring something to our game the other doesn't but line them up against a wall and I'll pick Wanyama first. I still maintain that no one believed he would get in ahead of Dier on the back of his season as DM that everyone was raving about, I still don't recall a single conversation about him starting ahead of Dier or Dembele. (I'd argue £11m is nothing for him, less than we paid for Davies and +£20m less them Kante, Xhaka, Schniderlin but think the money is arbitrary & not proof of importance or ability).

Actually I've changed my mind. Your right. Crosses are low percentage. We should stop doing them.

While we're at it shots are pretty low percentage to, shall we cut those out too?

 

[Don Corleone]

I hate it when Spurs fans say " we can't sign anyone that will improve our 1st 11" .... why not ? We are a CL and title contending club now. Ain't it about time we show some bloody ambition in the market ? We have not actually achieved anything yet and if we want to win stuff then we need more quality and a better squad. If we get in a player who's going to challenge Ali then what's the problem ? Means we have quality all over if players are off form or injured. I'm tired of the same old excuse of " well we have a great 1st 11 so can't improve " ..... title winners and big clubs buy and improve year in year out. What makes us so special ?

 

[sammyspurs]

People who think our first XI cannot be improved are like the people who in 1900 claimed humanity had invented everything possible.
Real Madrid, Juve, Bayern and Barcelona are all actively looking for players for their first eleven so so can we.

It can be improved....I can swap Eriksen for Messi.

The point is, that a lot of people are happy for us to build and grow, and a lot are happy for us start dismantling our best 11, yet none can say, unequivocally, who they would drop.

When pushed, they start babbling on about rotating and squad cover......the very thing they are arguing against.

 

[tbonepremier]

Respect yours too.
Trippier's delivery is way over hyped, people love a cross, just as people love a corner. I hate both as they are low percentage and rarely result in anything other than lost possession. It's all he does because it's all he can do. (Some of the balls he plays are sweet, think particularly one in his England debut the other week, hit the ball first time behind the defense, beauty) but all I see is ball after ball after ball pumped into the box sailing over the heads or into the arms of a greatful keeper, whilst everyone else shouts unlucky great cross.

Walker, Rose, Davies build our attacks (the former 2 excel at it) by taking on the oppo, stretching the defense keeping wide, turning defenses, dribbling into the box, cutting the ball back, playing the short ball, the ball before the assist. They create the pressure, keeping oppo FB's pinned back as their ability on the ball enable us to keep the ball.

FWIW I think Wanyama is marginally better than Dier as a DM, they are different and each bring something to our game the other doesn't but line them up against a wall and I'll pick Wanyama first. I still maintain that no one believed he would get in ahead of Dier on the back of his season as DM that everyone was raving about, I still don't recall a single conversation about him starting ahead of Dier or Dembele. (I'd argue £11m is nothing for him, less than we paid for Davies and +£20m less them Kante, Xhaka, Schniderlin but think the money is arbitrary & not proof of importance or ability).

I think your hatred of crosses clouds your vision. Trippier had five assists in 533 minutes in PL 16/17. That is probably higher than anyone having played anywhere near that amount of time or more.

I get that crosses are low chance, if you look at all crosses, by anyone, in any situation. Every possession of the ball has a low chance of turning into a goal as well. That doesn't mean we should stop giving Eriksen possession of the ball near the opponents box. Likewise, Trippier should be encouraged to cross the ball when he's in a good position to do so. He does it very well.

 

[Guido 🇺🇦]

This thread always seems to have several new pages whenever I look at it and yes some of the comments are aimed at other posts. Some comments not necessarily yours are saying we cannot improve the first 11 and players are bought as back up. I do not believe certain players are bought as back up but to play but whether they do is down to how they perform. Hence Wanyama made it and Sissoko did not yet Sissoko cost a lot more. As I said we need to name 18 players every match and on average say 2 players are injured meaning we need at least 20 players that can all play without weakening the team. We do not have that yet and thus need more players. We may never get there as there are bound to be failures. When we won the double we had the best 11 in the Country and yet broke our transfer record to buy Jimmy Greaves who replaced Les Allen. We may not be able to spend money like MC etc but need to add to the squad that play regularily to allow greater rotation in more positions. Poch ( not fans on this forum ) must decide if he can trust Sissoko, Wimmer and GKN to perform or replace them. The evidence last season was he does not trust them as he played them only rarely.

I agree 100% with what you have said. With nuanced with maybe a subtle difference: Our first 11 is fucking brilliant, it's one of the best out there and because of that it is very, very hard to find a player who will come in that is better 1v1 on position. If there are players out there then they are way, way out of our league (+£100m bracket etc). We do have players outside of the 11 that are not used, rarely get minutes who we can improve on, we should look to replace them with better players. Now if these players turn out to be better than the ones playing in the first 11 then happy fucking days (e.g. Wanyama, Dele) the fallback position to this is; if their presence provides competition to the counterpart first 11 player and they improve as a result of that competition, then also happy fucking days (e.g. Davies, Trippier, Wimmer (his first season)).

 

[sammyspurs]

You twist things something rotten and it's actually getting ridiculous. I said i would probably start Dembele against harder teams away and you've taken from that i would only start the new signing at home against easier teams like Huddersfield and Watford.

So basically ive said i would start the new marquee signing in MOST games wheras if we went the squad player option...i would start the same 11 as last season in most (if not all games). Notice there is a big difference.

No. Here is what you said

Dembele is probably my favourite player but if we get a fast paced attacking player (similar to mane) Poch could easily play a variation of the 3 at the back but slightly tweaked..

--------------------------Lloris----------------------------
-------Dier-------Alderweireld--Vertonghen----
Walker-------------Wanyama---------------Rose--
---------------Eriksen--------------New--------------
-------------------------Alli--------------------------------
--------------------------------Kane------------------


Of course Mousa would probably start the games against harder opposition (especially away) being that he is so good. Either way we need to target players that can definitely challenge for a starting spot (Barkley is not on that level).

So harder opposition, especially away Moussa starts yeah?

I'll take that as Chelsea, Liverpool, Utd, Woolwich, City, Everton, home and away. 12 games there for Dembele.
Possibly throw in Newcastle, Palace and West Ham away?

We're nearly up in half the season mate, yet you are prattling on about how signing squad players is defeatist.

Your solution is a squad player though, whatever your spin. You want a 40M marquee signing that we bench in the tough games.....laughable beyond belief.

Also fairly ridiculous that your marquee signing also requires a brand new formation to make it work......on the back of our best football in 30 odd years, you want to change it for some mysterious player you cant even name.