PSV away - UCL Matchday 3

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How was it deserved, the game operates on a set of laws, the part that applies is that there were two defenders ahead of the attacker and behind Lloris. The tackle was mistimed not reckless. Those are the parameters for a dismissal in that scenario neither were met. Check your bias then comment
Poorly timed and went studs up with his left foot. Just because he didn't break Lozano's leg doesn't make it not reckless.
 
I was thinking more of what everyone said about the positive effect Edgar Davids had when he came to the club. Somebody of that kind could be valuable to have around the place.
Don't get me wrong, I quite liked Davids, I think most fans did, but what effect are you talking about? I wouldn't attribute much of what he did as the standout. I always viewed him as a has been, the fact he came on a free and didn't complete 2 seasons with us kind of points to that. I don't like these type of signings to be honest, I think maybe there is some mileage in them if you are at the bottom of the league or are a team that's come up from the Championship with a load of young players e.g Steven Dafour for Burnley or Leicester signing Cambiasso but when you are already at the top of the league you need to look for players that are going to fight for a place in the starting eleven and remain there.

I think these types of signings are massive gambles and rarely work out, ask Sunderland, QPR and West Ham who I think have cornered the market in signing has-beens. Contrast that with Bournemouth, Wolves, Southampton to name but a few, they look at building a squads with an eye on the longer term.
 
Fair enough.
So why put so much emphasis on qualifying for it in the first place??

So many people on here get mocked and shat upon for expressing their anger at our complete disdain for the domestic trophies.

Then loads more get ridiculed and shat upon for being angry when we limp lamely out of the holy grail that is the champions league for which we jettisoned the domestic cups to qualify for!

Some have compared our strategy to Woolwich. But you could say it's even worse. At least they've won a few cups.

We just seem happy to take the money and hope for the best.

If you can't understand or empathise with the frustration and anger shown by supporters on here tonight, then I'd seriously question your own passion and emotions.

This is football. For some of us Its a massive part of our lives.

The answer is clearly the money BUT remember the excitement from many supporters at the chance to watch Messi etc. Personally I would have prefered an easier group, qualify and go further in the competition. However it would be a massive retrograde step to fail to qualify for next season's CL after 3 consecutive years.

2017-18 UEFA CHAMPIONS LEAGUE: PAYMENTS TO CLUBS
1. Real Madrid - £78.5m
2. Roma - £74.2m
3. Liverpool - £72m
4. Juventus - £70.9m
5. Bayern Munich - £62.4m
6. Chelsea - £57.7m
7. Manchester City - £56.5m
8. PSG - £54.9m
9. Tottenham - £54.2m
10. Barcelona - £50.8m
11. Sevilla - £42.8m
12. Monaco - £41.2m
13. Besiktas - £38.3m
14. Manchester United - £35.7m
15. Napoli - £34.5m
16. RB Leipzig - £30.5m
17. Celtic - £28.7m
18. Atletico Madrid - £28.1m
 
Trust me PSV were shit. Bossing the Dutch league only means so much.

We beat ourseves last night.

That last bit is what I am on about. I have little faith right now in our resolve. Squeezing out wins against opposition while playing ugly football is fine, but we haven’t shown a great deal of getting out of the funk.

It sounds like we played rather well last night, which is good to hear, but my sentiment going into the game was “I am not confident”
 
We can't really strip Hugo of being captain. But given how he's usually far from the action, and Harry has dropped deeper it might as well be an honorary title and have Harry as vice captain carry out the duties of screaming at everyone, because Poch is not a manager who jumps up and down in his area going nuts at the players like Klopp would.
 
Groundhog day - Constantly hearing alarm bells and reaching for the snooze button every time instead of opening one single gummed up bloodshot eye.
At this rate we won't roll out of bed and land face first in yesterday's soiled kecks until the place is on fire and the sprinklers come on.
 
We can't really strip Hugo of being captain. But given how he's usually far from the action, and Harry has dropped deeper it might as well be an honorary title and have Harry as vice captain carry out the duties of screaming at everyone, because Poch is not a manager who jumps up and down in his area going nuts at the players like Klopp would.

Klopp doesn't hammer the players; he just bafoons around like a performing monkey.

Karrius gate?
 
He slagged Son off in public so why not..... if we dont have a winners mentalility after 4 years of him in charge whose fault is it

He shouldn’t have slagged off Poch in public so maybe he’s learned his lesson

No manager should do that and expect respect

Can’t recall SAF ever doing it

Winning mentality is a separate but valid argument
 
To be fair, without watching it could seem it was 'same old, same old' - but the performance from ourselves (errors aside) was genuinely fun. Easily our best performance of the season and we were like Tottenham of old.

But you just knew the equaliser was imminent after Trippier conceded the free kick
 
He shouldn’t have slagged off Poch in public so maybe he’s learned his lesson

No manager should do that and expect respect

Can’t recall SAF ever doing it

Winning mentality is a separate but valid argument


What's this talk of Son/Poch beef?

This last night's presser or old news that i missed?
 
Haven't had a chance to watch the game, but in all honesty, I was expecting us to lose. I have not been convinced with body language, performance and just general fun the team is having out on the pitch. It is great that we keep winning in the league against the teams we should beat, but I for me those performances were full of languid play and a bunch of below par, individual performances.

PSV might not be Juventus or Barca, but they have a solid team that are champions of their domestic league. Remember when we waffled at Young Boys? Don't take any team lightly is the motto, but we just seem unable to kill a team off this year.

WC hangover? I'm not buying it. For me this is years of stagnancy finally catching up with us. The midfield has been our weakness since Modric left and Poch has done wonders to cover the patches, but the wood filler is chipping away.

We have quality in this team no doubt, but we greatly lack imagination and confidence on the ball in midfield and that greatly hampers our ability to kill teams off.

This opinion is not based on the PSV game as I haven't watched it or read any match report; this is based off 10 plus games now where we have struggled to look like a team. From the front to the back, things are out of sorts and I hope Poch can right the ship because next week we are in for a real test.

BTW...the best game aesthetically that we have played this year was in preseason with Skipp, Amos, and Marsh in midfield IMO.
Our midfield was brilliant when we had Sandro/Dembele and also in 15/16 and 16/17 with Dier/Dembele or Wanyama/Dembele. Also coincided with some of our strongest premier league finishes. In the recent times the only time we were shite with poch is when poch was infatuated with 'youf' and played Mason/Bentaleb as the main two. I hope he doesnt go for your suggestions of youth again with skipp,amos,marsh,winks in the middle. It will send us to the pre redknapp era.

Even last night when Dembele comes off we ended up with Winks (who is a hybrid of Mason and Paulinho without the attacking abilities) who has no awareness of where to be , running like a headless chicken. Our centre of midfield became flimsy as fuck , which screws up our defenders and then Lloris has to do retardedly difficult things to try to make up for it.
 
Poorly timed and went studs up with his left foot. Just because he didn't break Lozano's leg doesn't make it not reckless.
Studs up is what Snodgrass did to Moura last Saturday, not what our keeper did, look again mate that need to blame Lloris is making you look a fool. Maybe Hoddle agrees with you.
 
Our midfield was brilliant when we had Sandro/Dembele and also in 15/16 and 16/17 with Dier/Dembele or Wanyama/Dembele. Also coincided with some of our strongest premier league finishes. In the recent times the only time we were shite with poch is when poch was infatuated with 'youf' and played Mason/Bentaleb as the main two.

First part i totally agree with but think back... Mason & Bentaleb got their break because Capoue & Paulinho (+ Stambouli. lol ) were a bust and Dembele was patchy as fuck at the time, not cos Poch was on some moral crusade.

Even then M&B proved vital in helping us transition from the shitfest of the preceding 18 months.

You don't have to rate them as world beaters, but respect is definately due.
 
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Our midfield was brilliant when we had Sandro/Dembele and also in 15/16 and 16/17 with Dier/Dembele or Wanyama/Dembele. Also coincided with some of our strongest premier league finishes. In the recent times the only time we were shite with poch is when poch was infatuated with 'youf' and played Mason/Bentaleb as the main two. I hope he doesnt go for your suggestions of youth again with skipp,amos,marsh,winks in the middle. It will send us to the pre redknapp era.

Even last night when Dembele comes off we ended up with Winks (who is a hybrid of Mason and Paulinho without the attacking abilities) who has no awareness of where to be , running like a headless chicken. Our centre of midfield became flimsy as fuck , which screws up our defenders and then Lloris has to do retardedly difficult things to try to make up for it.

The youth was his first year. We boxed above our weight. The first year of Dembele/Dier we more or less played a 3 at the back when going forward. The wingbacks surged forwArd and a great deal of midfield was handled by Dembele. He isn’t their anymore. The following year it became more of a CM2 of Dier and Dembele and again, the Wingbacks were our focal point offensively. Why it worked was because we pressed so much harder. Each year that dies off a bit more and thus we rely on more handling of the ball in midfield, which isn’t Dier’s or Dembele’s strength. They are good at winning it back and recycling quick. They are not good at building up play.
 
Studs up is what Snodgrass did to Moura last Saturday, not what our keeper did, look again mate that need to blame Lloris is making you look a fool. Maybe Hoddle agrees with you.
It's not my need to blame Lloris as much as it is my need to not look at things through Lilywhite colored glasses.

If an identical play happens with Kane coming in and Alisson/DeGea/Kepa making the challenge, every one of you saying that Lloris shouldn't have been sent off would be screaming that Alisson/DeGea/Kepa should be. Hugo was put into a bad situation by a shit pass from Eriksen and Dier standing still as a statue while it was intercepted and played forward, but the simple fact is he made a poorly timed attempt with his left studs showing. I'd also suggest he came out too fast to begin with, like others have pointed out... Toby and Dave were right there.
 
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