England Manager

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English managers haven't really got a decent record of winning stuff. Especially in Europe.
The only 4 to win European cups were Busby, Clough, Fagan and Barton over an 8yr period between 1977 -1984.
The last English manager to win the UEFA cup.....Keith Burkinshaw. Before him Robson, Paisley and Bill Nic were the only others to win it. That's 4 English managers since 1972.

No English manager has won the PL.
Last English manager to win a title...Wilkinson.
From 67-87 English mangers did ok. Paisley winning 6, Clough 2, Revie 2, Kendall 2, Mercer, Catterick, Mee, Saunders and Fagan one each out of the 19 titles.
Since then just Howard Wilkinson.
Since Burkinshaw won his last FA cup in 1982 just 8 of the 34 FA cups have been won by 7 different English managers.
Since Venables last won it for us in 1991, only 2 of those 7 English mangers have won it since.
Royle in 95 and Redknapp in 2008.
 
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Melspurnian said:
It seems as though there are no astute english managers. They all want to play hoof-ball or some sort of possession-based game which leads to nothing. Not sure why this is though. Australia used to be like this and then we took a few absolute cuntings and decided to sack the manager. He came in and removed most of the older players and over the last few years we've won the asian cup and played some really pleasant football doing it. Maybe england just needs a complete re-set with a manager who won't take the bullshit some of the players put out on the pitch.
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Trouble is this country expects to win when we have not really been winners.
They will never give anyone the time to make a team.
The media influence the teams, calling for players to be included after one game. The media darlings are never dropped.
They crucify anyone who doesn't conform to their expectations .

What needs to be done is to start afresh.
A complete rebuild and an identity set. The manage needs to pick players based on who he feels will fit that identity. Not just shoehorn players in because they are doing well or have done well previously.
You have little time with the players so you cannot mould them.
Pick a system. Pick the players to make it work
if you're going to press, use players who can do that, regardless of where they play or what team they play for.
Have the bollocks to do that

If you're playing hoofball, or traditional English football, pick wingers and the big centre forward who's good with his head.
You have Dier, Walker, Rose, Ali and Kane in the English side, along with Lalana, Sturridge and Henderson yet you play them a different way - or a bastardised version - to the way they are showing the form to get picked in the first place. ( bar Sturridge who has no form this season)
Better not to have them and chose a players who are playing the way you want the team to play.
We may lose a few games, so be it. Yet we will have an identity and team.
Look at Lalana under Poch, then under Rodgers, then under Klopp.
He fits a certain style of football. That's why Klopp flogged Benteke.
 
DeeGee said:
Trouble is this country expects to win when we have not really been winners.
They will never give anyone the time to make a team.
The media influence the teams, calling for players to be included after one game. The media darlings are never dropped.
They crucify anyone who doesn't conform to their expectations .

What needs to be done is to start afresh.
A complete rebuild and an identity set. The manage needs to pick players based on who he feels will fit that identity. Not just shoehorn players in because they are doing well or have done well previously.
You have little time with the players so you cannot mould them.
Pick a system. Pick the players to make it work
if you're going to press, use players who can do that, regardless of where they play or what team they play for.
Have the bollocks to do that

If you're playing hoofball, or traditional English football, pick wingers and the big centre forward who's good with his head.
You have Dier, Walker, Rose, Ali and Kane in the English side, along with Lalana, Sturridge and Henderson yet you play them a different way - or a bastardised version - to the way they are showing the form to get picked in the first place. ( bar Sturridge who has no form this season)
Better not to have them and chose a players who are playing the way you want the team to play.
We may lose a few games, so be it. Yet we will have an identity and team.
Look at Lalana under Poch, then under Rodgers, then under Klopp.
He fits a certain style of football. That's why Klopp flogged Benteke.
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I agree with all of it but I think you should have given the fans a roasting as well , I think fans need to stop seeing the Liverpool shirt or the Woolwich shirt or the Tottenham shirt or whatever sholirt they don't like and just see the England shirt and get behind it. Its not just the media us fans are guilty of destroying players too look at the dogs abuse Kane and Sterling got at the Euros it goes well beyond criticism.
 
superstaryid said:
I agree with all of it but I think you should have given the fans a roasting as well , I think fans need to stop seeing the Liverpool shirt or the Woolwich shirt or the Tottenham shirt or whatever sholirt they don't like and just see the England shirt and get behind it. Its not just the media us fans are guilty of destroying players too look at the dogs abuse Kane and Sterling got at the Euros it goes well beyond criticism.
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I think the dogs abuse would disappear if the performance v Germany became the norm rather than the exception. If a team is fighting, winning and paying attractive stuff, criticism evaporates pdq.
 
White Van Jan said:
I think the dogs abuse would disappear if the performance v Germany became the norm rather than the exception. If a team is fighting, winning and paying attractive stuff, criticism evaporates pdq.
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Well yeah but as far as I can tell we went to the Euros with low expectations and they were matched , Ive no problem with players being critisced even harshly critisced but what happens in England is a witch hunt and its the fans aswell as the media who do the hunting , Raheem Sterling was poor and out of sorts before and during the Euros but the abuse he got on social media was borderline criminal the same with Wilshire and Kane , none of the players picked themselves and they all go there to give their best but failed completely to produce , critiscise yes but to hound young players like we do is counterproductive to their development and damn right damaging to our future hopes of progressing, many will disagree and i understand its a problem of our own making with repeated failure every two years but England don't have many supporters now they have critics. before the tournament it's "England are shit" England will never win anything" "England wont even get out of the group" the tournament ends and peoples doubts are proved correct then people absolutely slaughter the team for underacheiving even though nobody expected them to acheive , it is madness.
 
Besides the enjoyment of having Spurs players in there and a Defoe recall - the quality in that time is ridiculously small.

Then again, it's the mentality that needs to change and not the quality of players.
 
Totti said:
Besides the enjoyment of having Spurs players in there and a Defoe recall - the quality in that time is ridiculously small.

Then again, it's the mentality that needs to change and not the quality of players.
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Not much of a fuck could I give about England these days...but JD genuinely does & thoroughly deserves his recall to the squad. Very happy for him. A true professional & a bloody nice bloke from what I can gather.
 
Boltonspur said:
Not much of a fuck could I give about England these days...but JD genuinely does & thoroughly deserves his recall to the squad. Very happy for him. A true professional & a bloody nice bloke from what I can gather.
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Bumped into him in Chingford years back as his mother was still living there at the time and he was a genuinely nice bloke. Always got time for people.
 
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