Poch out?

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Poch out?

  • Yes

    Votes: 161 36.9%
  • No

    Votes: 275 63.1%

  • Total voters
    436
What has budget or lack of spending got to do with shit manager decisions?
Poch chose to play son lwb against Chelsea in the f.a cup semi
Poch chose to play vorm against man u in the f.a cup semi
Poch chose to drop Lucas for an unfit kane in the cl final

I don't think you will get alot of people saying we could not of done with a couple of more signings but they would not of got in the team over poch's favourites anyway
He has always had the 3rd/4th best squad in the league regardless of spending
He is not a great manager he is just a good manager. He has been found out or made bad decisions everytime it really mattered.
He has lost the dressing room and it's time for us to bring in someone who can win things

On behalf of Mick and John Thomas I will answer this:

“.....but signings.....”

I’m afraid nothing you said matters now, Baggio mate, sorry about that.
 
Looks like you've got no one to talk to this morning, sammy

:pochcry:

I would have something to talk about if you’d man up and tell me which one of Chelsea, Utd, Liverpool and Woolwich’s back up full backs, CMs, AMs, keepers and CBs are vastly superior to ours and explain how those squads have been improved much more than ours which has been “neglected” and “shat on”.

Maybe you think that having to play Nathanial Clyne when Arnold gets injured is elite.

Or perhaps that Tammy Abraham (free) is backing, but Kane (free) is shitting on Poch.

I’ll never know, because you can’t answer the question. Because your whole point of view is based on nothing more than some kind of personal hatred of Levy and Lewis.

A fan that demands this club be more like City and Chelsea......accusing others of being plastic.

Hahahahahaaha
 
I would have something to talk about if you’d man up and tell me which one of Chelsea, Utd, Liverpool and Woolwich’s back up full backs, CMs, AMs, keepers and CBs are vastly superior to ours and explain how those squads have been improved much more than ours which has been “neglected” and “shat on”.

Maybe you think that having to play Nathanial Clyne when Arnold gets injured is elite.

Or perhaps that Tammy Abraham (free) is backing, but Kane (free) is shitting on Poch.

I’ll never know, because you can’t answer the question. Because your whole point of view is based on nothing more than some kind of personal hatred of Levy and Lewis.

A fan that demands this club be more like City and Chelsea......accusing others of being plastic.

Hahahahahaaha
I aint wasting my weekend providing you with your Sunday morning wanking material. Get your own man.
Fair enough. Some people want Poch out. I get that.
But at least they acknowledge what he's achieved, and he's achieved it on an uneven playing field.
You hate this club Sammy. You hate the players and the manager so much any reasonable argument is rendered worthless.
 
Just a reminder of 50 of the best times we've had under Poch so far. Great selection of matches including a couple of forgotten about



I have my criticisms of Poch as a manager but think he will continue to be Spurs manager this season, before sitting down with Daniel in the summer to review the season and what is best for the future.

And Daniel will invest in January to freshen up the squad again, but as the January TW generally gas fewer transfers it will probably be one or two players in with more expected in the summer. But Daniel will try to show committment to Poch in January if the players are available.
 
I have my criticisms of Poch as a manager but think he will continue to be Spurs manager this season, before sitting down with Daniel in the summer to review the season and what is best for the future.

And Daniel will invest in January to freshen up the squad again, but as the January TW generally gas fewer transfers it will probably be one or two players in with more expected in the summer. But Daniel will try to show committment to Poch in January if the players are available.
Interesting summarization.
Personally I think Daniel is now caught between a rock and a hard place.
If he sacks Mauricio, he knows the chances of finding another manager able to achieve his targets under the current model are next to zero.
On the other hand, keeping a manager when a vociferous, bitter section of the support want blood risks some of the venom turning on himself.
Whatever happens, I'm sure Daniel will do whatever he thinks best for the business.
 
Still undecided. It’s always difficult when a manager struggles to turn it around but we know Poch has turned water into wine before it’s just whether how he was for the first few years at the club he can get back or if it’s over now.

If he stays.

1 Eriksen, Toby, Rose, Aurier must be dropped, removed from the squad if they are causing mischief behind the scenes even.

2 End the diamond, I am sure it could work with the right players but not now, be more pragmatic.

3. Make it clear to Levy in Jan that the wants ways and those not good enough have to go and we need a RB, CB and DM in January no ifs no buts. If the club fail to sort this then resign, it should have been done last summer or even the summer before, this is the final chance even if we pay over the odds. Stadium is no excuse anymore.
 
Still undecided. It’s always difficult when a manager struggles to turn it around but we know Poch has turned water into wine before it’s just whether how he was for the first few years at the club he can get back or if it’s over now.

If he stays.

1 Eriksen, Toby, Rose, Aurier must be dropped, removed from the squad if they are causing mischief behind the scenes even.

2 End the diamond, I am sure it could work with the right players but not now, be more pragmatic.

3. Make it clear to Levy in Jan that the wants ways and those not good enough have to go and we need a RB, CB and DM in January no ifs no buts. If the club fail to sort this then resign, it should have been done last summer or even the summer before, this is the final chance even if we pay over the odds. Stadium is no excuse anymore.
January transfers are traditionally garbage though, we'll be able to get rid of our shit...but we'll only be able to buy other team's shit to replace them...
 
January transfers are traditionally garbage though, we'll be able to get rid of our shit...but we'll only be able to buy other team's shit to replace them...

That’s the problem, bit too late. Kind of hoping the likes of Foyth, Sessegnon, Sanchez and Tanganga can really step up. They are good players.

Verts still seems interested but he has lost a yard or two of pace. Anyway if we fail in Jan the summer needs to be quite brutal.
 
For me the question comes down to this. After everything we've achieved in the last 5 years, have we earned a spot at the top table? Are we a big club now? Or are we still plucky little Tottenham who have no business being in a CL final and should be happy just to be hovering around Woolwich.

If it's the former then changing the manager in these circumstances is perfectly logical and acceptable, you could not lose the way we lost the last 2 games, after 9 months of horrible form and a CL final defeat, and expect to survive. A pink slip would have been delivered in the tunnel after the final whistle at Brighton. Big clubs cannot accept prolonged periods of bad results and performances combined with constant obnoxious media statements from the manager.

If you see us as just "lads, it's Tottenham" then I understand why you'd be hesitant to sack Poch, he's achieved his mission of taking us into the top 4 while the stadium was being built and exceeded his mission objective by reaching the CL final. You might think that this is as good as it could ever get for us in this world of blood money clubs, in which case keeping the guy who brought us this far seems like the best way to guarantee we stay at this level.

Personally I feel that, prior to this season, we had shown the world that we were a top team and that we belonged with the big boys. I won't accept keeping Poch if it means a continuation of this form until January when we can have a clear-out. The players we have are better than what they are showing and the manager needs to find a way to get results NOW. If he can't do that then it's time to go. Massive credit to Poch for taking us up the football ladder in the last 5 years but as good a job as he has done, this is still Tottenham Hotspur and not Pochettino FC. What matters is that Tottenham win games, not that we indulge the manager. Managers come and go.

The first thing Poch has always said when we lose games or don't win finals is that people don't "understand our project" that you cannot "compare Tottenham with another club". I.e. we should be thankful that we are where we are and not get too excited. Well that might have passed muster in 14/15 but we are in the 19/20 season now and just played a CL final. That phase of the project is over, he got us where we needed to go. The next phase involves winning enough games to challenge Liverpool, not losing almost every away game for an entire year.

Good post but you could extrapolate different but equally valid conclusions from your analysis.

For me, it's a question of whether Poch's heart is in it. If he is still truly committed to 'the project' then he's earned the right to have a go at refreshing the squad over the next year (January is not long enough). The need to do this has been obvious to any astute fan, let alone anyone behind the scenes, for the past 18 months.

If he's mentally checked out then we need to think about the next stage ASAP. We should be looking at a combination of a steady the ship candidate followed by someone longer-term if we need to move during the season. No point in continuing with someone unhappy.

But, hearsay notwithstanding, only Poch knows where he is at the moment. He's more than earned the right to have a go but we can't be sentimental about it, and if he wants to move on so be it.
 
Good post but you could extrapolate different but equally valid conclusions from your analysis.

For me, it's a question of whether Poch's heart is in it. If he is still truly committed to 'the project' then he's earned the right to have a go at refreshing the squad over the next year (January is not long enough). The need to do this has been obvious to any astute fan, let alone anyone behind the scenes, for the past 18 months.

If he's mentally checked out then we need to think about the next stage ASAP. We should be looking at a combination of a steady the ship candidate followed by someone longer-term if we need to move during the season. No point in continuing with someone unhappy.

But, hearsay notwithstanding, only Poch knows where he is at the moment. He's more than earned the right to have a go but we can't be sentimental about it, and if he wants to move on so be it.

When he hands in the team sheet on Saturday, we will know whether he is really ready for another 5 years here. There are players here that we want to sell, who want to go, who are playing like shit and have not been dropped thus far. If they are still in the team against Watford then Poch has stopped caring.

If he’s serious about the future with us then he needs to give all those players the same treatment he gave Kaboul, Adebayor, Capoue etc. Get them out of the team and give KWP, Sessegnon, Foyth, Sanchez, Skipp, Tanganga and Parrott a chance instead. It is impossible that they could do worse.
 
When he hands in the team sheet on Saturday, we will know whether he is really ready for another 5 years here. There are players here that we want to sell, who want to go, who are playing like shit and have not been dropped thus far. If they are still in the team against Watford then Poch has stopped caring.

If he’s serious about the future with us then he needs to give all those players the same treatment he gave Kaboul, Adebayor, Capour etc. Get them out of the team and give KWP, Sessegnon, Foyth, Sanchez, Skipp, Tanganga and Parrott a chance instead. It is impossible that they could do worse.

If Poch has the courage to chuck out the liabilities we should stand by him.
 
On behalf of Mick and John Thomas I will answer this:

“.....but signings.....”

I’m afraid nothing you said matters now, Baggio mate, sorry about that.
You will never speak for me, because you are neither articulate enough nor possess the wit, intelligence, knowledge, experience or understanding to do so.
All you can do is to post things I haven't said, and then attempt to ridicule me for it.
Dream on bonehead
 
When he hands in the team sheet on Saturday, we will know whether he is really ready for another 5 years here. There are players here that we want to sell, who want to go, who are playing like shit and have not been dropped thus far. If they are still in the team against Watford then Poch has stopped caring.

If he’s serious about the future with us then he needs to give all those players the same treatment he gave Kaboul, Adebayor, Capoue etc. Get them out of the team and give KWP, Sessegnon, Foyth, Sanchez, Skipp, Tanganga and Parrott a chance instead. It is impossible that they could do worse.
Bullshit, he HAS to pick the best players at his disposal - If they chose to chuck the towel in and let us as supporters down then blame the guilty.
Playing ill equipped second stringers is a pointless excercise
 
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Bullshit, he HAS to pick the best players at his disposal - If they chose to chuck the towel in and let us as supporters down then blame the guilty.
Playing I'll equipped second stringers is a pointless excercise
Just asking but based on that should he select an Eriksen who doesn't give a shit or give a 'second stringer' a chance because at least he'll get 100% effort and commitment from him on the pitch ?. Which one helps the team more, a moody, talented star who doesn't play anywhere near as well as he can or an up and coming youngster who would relish the opportunity to show the manager what he can do ? For me it will always be the latter.
The 'best available' isn't rated by reputation but current form and that leaves out quite a few first team 'regulars' at the moment in my books.
 
Bullshit, he HAS to pick the best players at his disposal - If they chose to chuck the towel in and let us as supporters down then blame the guilty.
Playing I'll equipped second stringers is a pointless excercise

Were you saying that in 14/15 when he chucked out Kaboul, Adebayor, Paulinho etc and replaced them with Dier, Mason, Bentaleb and Kane?

The “best” players are playing horribly and don’t want to be here anymore. It’s time to move on. They had a chance against Brighton to show that they can still be trusted after the Bayern game and they blew it. The best players are the ones who are ready to work hard. Not people just going through the motions waiting for the transfer window to open. There have to be consequences for such bad performances.
 
Just asking but based on that should he select an Eriksen who doesn't give a shit or give a 'second stringer' a chance because at least he'll get 100% effort and commitment from him on the pitch ?. Which one helps the team more, a moody, talented star who doesn't play anywhere near as well as he can or an up and coming youngster who would relish the opportunity to show the manager what he can do ? For me it will always be the latter.
The 'best available' isn't rated by reputation but current form and that leaves out quite a few first team 'regulars' at the moment in my books.

This season I’m in the camp of hunger over talent.
Unfortunately our most talented players aren’t performing and I don’t see Poch being able to change that.

But whether those kids can actually hack it at the very top level is another thing altogether.
 
Interesting summarization.
Personally I think Daniel is now caught between a rock and a hard place.
If he sacks Mauricio, he knows the chances of finding another manager able to achieve his targets under the current model are next to zero.
On the other hand, keeping a manager when a vociferous, bitter section of the support want blood risks some of the venom turning on himself.
Whatever happens, I'm sure Daniel will do whatever he thinks best for the business.

The majority of Pochs "best/favourite' team has been at Spurs for longer than him. So from Levy ( and even the fans pov ) Poch had done well with them.

But Levy is a realist and the squad needs a refresh/ rebuild after that many of the squad staying that long , which Levy understands - he's an astute business man.

With the stadium now in operation with good cash flows so Levy is keen to invest to keep a good team at the stadium to keep the good cash flows going ( and probably increasing) - not getting European football for example sees cash flow reducing. So it's not an option not to invest.

Last summer Levy invested over £100m in the squad to bring in Ndomele, Lo Celso Sessegnon and ( for the future) Clarke - but probably ideally would have wanted to bring in one or two more. Rumour for example is that Joachim Anderson (CB) was due to join but Lyon said Ndombele wasn't going to be joining without Spurs dropping out of the bidding for Anderson meaning that Anderson joined Lyon. And Dyabla rumoured to be a possibility. But a decent TW on the players brought in.

As we all know only Ndombele has been available so far, so still 2 signings to have an effect on Spurs - plus the likes of Dele to come into some form. So I can't see Levy immediately losing confidence in Poch, even though he must be frustrated at how things have turned out. That's why I cannot see an immediate change - Levy invests for the long term not just one season.

And with Vertonghen and Alderweireld getting to the end of their top class careers, Eriksen seeing want to go, Rose also whilst Wanyama too injured and Aurier - just a poor buy.. So both Levy and Poch understand that more changes we necessary.

That's why Levy will invest in January - irrespective of manager Spurs need to refresh the squad with s few leaving. But bringing in maybe 6 players and that number leaving means it will take both January and summer TWs to achieve.

Imo Poch can help himself by dropping the diamond, good to try perhaps, but Poch needs to change to a different formation. And Poch could play more youth and even dropping some players to play others etc But those are details for Poch to decide on - and only if Poch doesn't get results (however judged) is Poch not wanted at Spurs. Unless at some stage Poch decided he wants a change.
 
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