Louis Van Gaal

[CJJ]

From Salmon's point of view, I think it's easy to see that if we went back in time to one of Harry's pre-england rumour matches, if we played Everton we'd expect to, and most likely, destroy them, without Lloris or Jan, and with Gomes and the rest of the dross we had back then.

That could be because Moyes was managing Everton then though

I can see that although the team looks a bit pants on paper, there are external factors which contribute to a great side - cohesion, tactical familiary, morale and motivation - things which we're missing in this season's squad - even if it is the strongest on paper.

So you're both right, you're just trying to say that eggs are better than bricks - depends on the context

 

[Smoked Salmon]

From Salmon's point of view, I think it's easy to see that if we went back in time to one of Harry's pre-england rumour matches, if we played Everton we'd expect to, and most likely, destroy them, without Lloris or Jan, and with Gomes and the rest of the dross we had back then.

That could be because Moyes was managing Everton then though

I can see that although the team looks a bit pants on paper, there are external factors which contribute to a great side - cohesion, tactical familiary, morale and motivation - things which we're missing in this season's squad - even if it is the strongest on paper.

So you're both right, you're just trying to say that eggs are better than bricks - depends on the context

The difference is that I don't need to deride sammy's view of it as ludicrous and farcical nonsense that he's desperate to wriggle out of. That's the difference between trolling and not, and very ironic for someone playing victim all the time (or not as that wiki quote earlier proves).

I absolutely do believe that the pre-England Harry team had a far greater expectation of blowing Everton away than this current lot does and I remember the confidence we'd have going into such a game, which simply doesn't exist now...and I believe this for the reasons I have already stated. Something I have no interest is wriggling out of....and yes I would play the 09-10 team tomorrow if I had the choice, even if it meant having to field some weaker players in some position, such as Gomes over Lloris. My ultimate objective would be whatever is in the interest of THFC and securing the win as a collective team, not individual talents...and the ultimate proof of the point I am making about it not just being the depth and quality of the squad is borne out by the fact that the 09-10 squad was competing at, arguably, a slightly higher level than this one. If it were just about strength and depth this current squad should be well above that one and therefore is grossly under performing. Factor in management, morale, formation, gelling and so on and it becomes a lot less simplistic as sammy would have us believe.

Think of my argument like this, you can have some of the finest ingredients in the world to make your favourite recipe, but if you don't cook it in the right way then you can find yourself eating something vastly inferior to what a skilled chef might make with a few cheap alternatives and a couple of good utensils.

 

[CJJ]

Think of my argument like this, you can have some of the finest ingredients in the world to make your favourite recipe, but if you don't cook it in the right way then you can find yourself eating something vastly inferior to what a skilled chef might make with a few cheap alternatives and a couple of good utensils.

 

[zin]

What's with the Gomes hate @ sammyspurs ? The season we finished 4th I seem to recall Gomes played out of his skin against Woolwich and Chelsea in succession, without those performences you would not be using your "Harry took us to a quarter-final against Real Madrid in the CL" line - show him some respect, if you're going to use the "Bale wasn't the same player then" line then Gomes was not the clown you make him out to be.

 

[Smoked Salmon]

What's with the Gomes hate @ sammyspurs ? The season we finished 4th I seem to recall Gomes played out of his skin against Woolwich and Chelsea in succession, without those performences you would not be using your "Harry took us to a quarter-final against Real Madrid in the CL" line - show him some respect, if you're going to use the "Bale wasn't the same player then" line then Gomes was not the clown you make him out to be.

I honestly never quite understood why Gomes fell as far down the pecking order as he did. Sure, he made a few howlers in his last season, but it was by no means awful...not bad enough in my view to not be second choice. Yet three managers later and he's still shining Brad's shoes, despite being an international keeper for Brazil. It baffles me to this day. I'd be curious to see what has gone on behind the scenes.

 

[Dutchy]

Don't think Louis van Gaal appreciates all this off-topic talk in His thread. Let Him be the subject of your posts.

Spoiler

 

[zin]

Don't think Louis van Gaal appreciates all this off-topic talk in His thread. Let Him be the subject of your posts.

Spoiler

Assuming you're Dutch, what's your take on Van Gaal? Where does he rank to compare with Advocaat, Hiddink and de Boer?

 

[CJJ]

 

[Cornish Lilywhite]

Unless I'm misinterprin ating it, I read the topic as Sammy saying our squad is stronger now as a unit than it was when we had Modric/Bale, rather than we have better players than those two.

Similarly, we have a better squad now than in 98/99, but I'd love to have a player like David Ginola in the team now. Maybe because he stood out because the rest of our team was weak, I don't know. No offence to Allan Nielsen!

Jesus, that would be the Allan Nielsen that scored the winner in a cup final. Lay off!!!!!

 

[sammyspurs]

What's with the Gomes hate @ sammyspurs ? The season we finished 4th I seem to recall Gomes played out of his skin against Woolwich and Chelsea in succession, without those performences you would not be using your "Harry took us to a quarter-final against Real Madrid in the CL" line - show him some respect, if you're going to use the "Bale wasn't the same player then" line then Gomes was not the clown you make him out to be.

I dont hate Gomes and I havent made him out to be a clown. Why are you making shit up.

Lloris is far better than Gomes thats all.

Or is that too going to be denied?

You people are getting fucking desperate, lol

 

[CJJ]

Jesus, that would be the Allan Nielsen that scored the winner in a cup final. Lay off!!!!!

 

[Dutchy]

Assuming you're Dutch, what's your take on Van Gaal? Where does he rank to compare with Advocaat, Hiddink and de Boer?

Obviously, I''ll only discuss it with regard to the (potential) Spurs job.

This is what i said earlier (Capello, van Gaal or de Boer?): "No hesitation, Louis van Gaal. Immense coach, experienced, clear football philosophy, attractive football and knows what is needed at a top club. Capello could work out as well though, but I prefer the football Van Gaal wants to play. Frank de Boer is not an option, as he stated himself."

At the time de Boer was not an option. Recently, some 'rumours' circulated that he is interested in managing Spurs or Liverpool. This was taken out of context, as he only answered positively to a question if he could ever coach Spurs or Liverpool. De Boer is very thoughful and careful when it comes to decisions, definitely when it comes to potential clubs to manage. I still highly doubt that he would leave Ajax at the end of the season. If he does and he feels comfortable with the organization (especially Levy) and feels he can work with lots of freedom, then i would take him over everyone else. He's highly rated and talked about by all of his players and staff, journalists, managers (Cruijff, Hiddink, van Gaal etc.) and fans. He is down to earth, very good with the media and communication in general and has a clear vision and sticks to it no matter what (this has earned him much praise and almost four championships).

Regarding your other suggestions; Hiddink will coach Holland national team after WC in Brazil, and has a poor health at the moment so also no option short term. Advocaat? Starts doing weird things when under pressure, can't work in Premier League i think. Not on the level of De Boer and Van Gaal.

IMO both Van Gaal and De Boer would be good choices (IF Sherwoord leaves). Very different coaches in the way they deal with players and especially the media (Van Gaal can be a madman sometimes). Van Gaal wins it experience-wise. De Boer wins it in almost all other departments. Still, experience is of great importance in the EPL i think.

I'm tired now, peace.

 

[Cornish Lilywhite]

Sincere apologies...... You hid it so well

 

[CJJ]

Sincere apologies...... You hid it so well

If I suggested Ginola was a star player, I would get told that it was only because everyone else was crap then and he only stood out for that reason. I'm a big fan of him, although plenty don't like him and perhaps would say that he didn't contribute much.

It made sense in the context of the discussion at that point about squad/players and what makes a team.

Nielsen was intentionally the point with the Cup final, as we had plenty of strong midfielders back then even if they weren't thought of as "star players". I think Ginola had even been taken off just before Nielsen scored?

 

[zin]

I dont hate Gomes and I havent made him out to be a clown. Why are you making shit up.

You talk about him like he was so bad that anyone would think he cost us game after game that season. Why use him in your example if it was not to make your point that this squad is so much better than that squad? Why single him out? Or are you just misunderstood once again?

 

[Tucker]

If I suggested Ginola was a star player, I would get told that it was only because everyone else was crap then and he only stood out for that reason. I'm a big fan of him, although plenty don't like him and perhaps would say that he didn't contribute much.

Ginola in his prime would be amazing for us now.

 

[zin]

Lloris is far better than Gomes thats all.
Or is that too going to be denied?

You bang on about how Bale of that season was not the Bale of last season yet insist Lloris of this year is far better than Gomes of that year. It's like your opinion is not to be questioned but here you are using Gomes as an example yet you use the current opinion of him to make your point.

Why not use Lennon in your example? What if I was to say the Lennon of that year was better than the Lennon of this year and the Palacios of that year was better than the Sandro of this year? That would mean our entire midfield of that year was better no? or is that so outlandish to suggest?

You people are getting fucking desperate, lol

Enough with this shit. "You people" "fucking deperate" you need to get a grip with comments like this. "Us people" are Spurs fans much like you are with differing opinions, if you haven't notice "Us people" tend to disagree with you as much as we agree with you on other matters - I'm sure we're not "desperate" then in your eyes.

 

[CJJ]

Ginola in his prime would be amazing for us now.

I agree. I had a mate who was a newcastle fan and he would talk about how Spurs wanted Ferdinand, so when we got Ginola for, what, £3m? I was a bit conflicted with "didn't want him" and "that's cheap", but I'd put him in my top 3 Spurs players.

I always remember he said he'd love to manage spurs one day or return as a coach. If he was Sherwood now, I'd have a lot more to say on the subject as he's more endearing as a player of our past.

 

[Tucker]

I agree. I had a mate who was a newcastle fan and he would talk about how Spurs wanted Ferdinand, so when we got Ginola for, what, £3m? I was a bit conflicted with "didn't want him" and "that's cheap", but I'd put him in my top 3 Spurs players.

I always remember he said he'd love to manage spurs one day or return as a coach. If he was Sherwood now, I'd have a lot more to say on the subject as he's more endearing as a player of our past.

He'll always go down as one of our greats for me. Even if he was playing in an awful team. Remember being a bit pissed off when we signed him though. How stupid huh.

 

[sammyspurs]

You talk about him like he was so bad that anyone would think he cost us game after game that season. Why use him in your example if it was not to make your point that this squad is so much better than that squad? Why single him out? Or are you just misunderstood once again?

I feel like Im alone in this thread.....and everyone else has turned into Arcspace.

Cut the hysterics. Lloris > Gomes. End of......if you think that means I HATE!!!!!!! Gomes, then thats you have sensitivity issues