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contradiction
kɒntrəˈdɪkʃ(ə)n/
noun
  1. a combination of statements, ideas, or features which are opposed to one another. "the proposed new system suffers from a set of internal contradictions"
    • a situation in which inconsistent elements are present.
      "the paradox of using force to overcome force is a real contradiction"
    • the statement of a position opposite to one already made. eg:
      There's a young hasidic jew who goes into the Yucatan pub in Stoke Newington to watch Chelsea games.
 

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What cultural bond is that? Do we sell platzels at half time? Slap mizuzahs on the stadium doorways? Shut down for Rosh Hashaneh? The only link is the once upon a time we were popular with Jewish football goers when there were a lot of Jewish Londoners. That was decades ago. Now actual Jewish football fans are a minority and plenty, sadly, support the scum as well. The idea of us being a Jewish club is mostly driven now by the fact that our owners and chairman are Jewish and by mostly gentile fans who have appropriated the identity, and the expression "yid", for themselves. For this reason I don't see why young Jews abroad should be drawn to us (or Ajax for that matter). It's also one of the reasons why I get a bit embarrassed when gentiles fly the Israeli flag at games as it neither represents the club or it's remaining Jewish fans.
I remember my first game (West Stand) they were selling Bagels - didn't see that in many other grounds. Not in PLU though.
 

Smoked Salmon

Finest human being of all time
I remember my first game (West Stand) they were selling Bagels - didn't see that in many other grounds. Not in PLU though.
Bagels (or biegels as must London Jews used to know them) are hardly Jewish culture these days. They're pretty mainstream.

That said, I miss those bagels. I likes the, you guessed it, smoked salmon and cream cheese one. It's what inspired my username!
 
I've had this argument before. I find it immensely patronising.

It is completely different. The fact that many can't afford to support their team is testament to that.
I agree. When I started going I was a kid, of 11. You don't see many kids unaccompanied at games anymore.
It's totally different.
The season in Div 2 was great. When we got relegated there was just as much passion from the fans as at the finale.
Yet I do remember Burkinshaw urging us to get behind the team in the programme for Everton at home, we drew 3-3.
It wasn't all good. We were treated badly with bad facilities and it was sometimes dangerous, crushes etc.
It all coincided with all seaters as well as the PL.
Seats were for those who wanted to sit and watch.
Terraces were for those who wanted to stand, sing and fuck about.
Used to be £1.50 to stand which is about £7 today.
Now it's roughly £30 for the cheapest ticket.

For me safe standing is the only way. It also has to be cheaper to stand. That's the point. Sell 2/3 as ST for £100 the rest to members at £10 a pop. Make it clear these will be not be family friendly areas.

Even if you got 5,000 like minded in the bottom third of the new south stand safe standing the atmosphere would be 10x better.
 
You're right. Most find it abit odd I think. I do know an Israeli st holder though who I think started supporting us when he got here because of the "yid army" thing.

Found it odd when lazio (?) fans had Palestinian flags. The conflict really doesn't need football lads hijacking it...
Celtic - have fines from UEFA for flying Palestinian flags
 
Bagels (or biegels as must London Jews used to know them) are hardly Jewish culture these days. They're pretty mainstream.

That said, I miss those bagels. I likes the, you guessed it, smoked salmon and cream cheese one. It's what inspired my username!
I was only joking but I did read platzels as pretzels so that was where I was coming from... On a side note just picked a dozen biegels from Brick Lane if anyone wants any.
 
I agree. When I started going I was a kid, of 11. You don't see many kids unaccompanied at games anymore.
It's totally different.
The season in Div 2 was great. When we got relegated there was just as much passion from the fans as at the finale.
Yet I do remember Burkinshaw urging us to get behind the team in the programme for Everton at home, we drew 3-3.
It wasn't all good. We were treated badly with bad facilities and it was sometimes dangerous, crushes etc.
It all coincided with all seaters as well as the PL.
Seats were for those who wanted to sit and watch.
Terraces were for those who wanted to stand, sing and fuck about.
Used to be £1.50 to stand which is about £7 today.
Now it's roughly £30 for the cheapest ticket.

For me safe standing is the only way. It also has to be cheaper to stand. That's the point. Sell 2/3 as ST for £100 the rest to members at £10 a pop. Make it clear these will be not be family friendly areas.

Even if you got 5,000 like minded in the bottom third of the new south stand safe standing the atmosphere would be 10x better.

I also think its as important to ensure mates can sit together - just from 1882 you see how 30-40 people on the same wave length sitting in the same place can generate atmosphere.

My solution to this while also understanding the clubs reluctance to have paying on the day on the door. Have 300-400 tickets behind the goal on sale on the door. Can only be bought by members and on debit cards (cards match registered member) - then allocated seats on the ticket. Groups will be able to go from the pub to the ground and will also encourage people to get in and create an atmosphere early. Any rules on pre-game drinking on the stand (no drinking 20 minutes before KO)
 

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But have they actually been priced out of going or is it a conscious choice for them to just refuse paying over a certain level.......is their support based on the cost of going being incidental to their wealth......

there are plenty of teams I wouldn't bother opening my curtains to watch, clearly that isn't the case with Spurs - it could even be argued that the ticket prices for many matches are too low given that virtually every match is a sell out

Personally I think football tickets are over priced but you've got rise tinted glasses on if you look back with fondness at a time when tickets were ten a penny and don't question why they were so easy to come by........something must not have been too great about the whole match day experience
If you are unemployed you can't afford football. Unless you have saved from previous employment or are involved with criminality.
If you are 16 and in college from a one parent family, you cannot afford to go to football. You get about £60pw.
Not everyone has a decent paid job and can afford a ST or credit card debt.
Like I said before if football prices rose to inflation it would be £7-£10 for the cheapest ticket.
Also our average attendance in 78 in div 2 was 33,000.

Btw the average weekly wage is supposed to be £500. £100 per day.
Yet who actually earns £2k a month working in shops, restaurants, labouring , customer services, or other non skilled jobs?
A friend doesn't even get that and he manages a restaurant. He relies on a decent trunc to get that.
 
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Smoked Salmon

Finest human being of all time
I was only joking but I did read platzels as pretzels so that was where I was coming from... On a side note just picked a dozen biegels from Brick Lane if anyone wants any.
I prefer their platzels funnily enough (the onion ones, yum!). Am a regular visitor there, mainly because of the prices and great quality.
 

Smoked Salmon

Finest human being of all time
I also think its as important to ensure mates can sit together - just from 1882 you see how 30-40 people on the same wave length sitting in the same place can generate atmosphere.

My solution to this while also understanding the clubs reluctance to have paying on the day on the door. Have 300-400 tickets behind the goal on sale on the door. Can only be bought by members and on debit cards (cards match registered member) - then allocated seats on the ticket. Groups will be able to go from the pub to the ground and will also encourage people to get in and create an atmosphere early. Any rules on pre-game drinking on the stand (no drinking 20 minutes before KO)
How are you going to ensure those 300-400 tickets won't be bought by people simply looking for a ticket?
 
Celtic - have fines from UEFA for flying Palestinian flags
Good. Most of their fans don't have a clue about the situation. They just do it because they belive it replicates the republican view point. It doesn't do anyone any favours, particularly the Palestinians.

They can stick to theirs and rangers little beef.
 
The 1981 final cost £2.50. I assume that was the cheapest ticket, I was in the home end standing.
going by the Bank of England inflation calculater, and I've rounded it up, that would be £10 today.
Yet the cheapest ticket for a semi or final at Wembley today is £50 isn't it?
5 x the rate.
That's more than cigarettes which is about 3x
 
I was there last Feb and surprised how little presence or relevance Spurs had .
Talking to a bunch of very friendly 19 years ish jewish lads kicking a ball around , their families originally from Iran, Algeria and Eastern Europe had no knowledge of us and all supported Madrid. They all wanted to be identified with winners not cultural bonds , if there are any really. This was at Tiberius on the sea of Galilee .
The odd Sports bar l saw in Tel Aviv nothing there . Many recent arrivals from Russia have no links to anything in Western Europe.
AS from a Christian heritage it was hard maybe to break down barriers.
The absolute majority are manu\pool and arse*** after them. Our heritage as the Jewish club was rather unknown here up until the early 00's (as the british Jewish community is very "distant" from Israel unlike the American one and the fact that support for foreign football was superficial). Most know Ajax but a few know of us or Bayern.

Though in recent year there is a surge of new supporters also due to our image as the Jewish club becoming more known, but bottom line most pick teams according to success (local chelsea supporters don't understand why I go all red when I see them in the blue shirt as their NF\C18 history is also unknown). Imagine what it was like growing up back in the days here, I literally knew no other spurs supporter until the internet came and we created a network.

p.s. Tiberius...I doubt they can even point to Britain on a globe there. backwater shitehole. Also sports bars or bars in general are no where the "Anglophiles" watch matches, it's considered tacky.
 
Bagels (or biegels as must London Jews used to know them) are hardly Jewish culture these days. They're pretty mainstream.

That said, I miss those bagels. I likes the, you guessed it, smoked salmon and cream cheese one. It's what inspired my username!
There was a bagel shop in Club Wembley for the Burnley game, the smoked salmon and cream cheese was delicious. The shop wasn't there for Dortmund though, at least, I couldn't find it (I'd had a beer or two so could easily have missed it). I will look out for it again tomorrow.
 
Can I ask not being from London my self but obviously knowing the yid/Jew link with Tottenham does local Jewish organisations associate with the club? Kids clubs,youth organisations ect ect being a Jewish area and the club supporting it in different ways redevelopment and investment are they included? Or do they do their own thing
 

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Smoked Salmon

Finest human being of all time
Can I ask not being from London my self but obviously knowing the yid/Jew link with Tottenham does local Jewish organisations associate with the club? Kids clubs,youth organisations ect ect being a Jewish area and the club supporting it in different ways redevelopment and investment are they included? Or do they do their own thing
Tottenham is not a Jewish area. The only real Jewish areas these days are probably Golders Green, Stamford Hill and in and around Barnet. Tottenham is now mostly black, eastern European and white.
 
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