I rewrote the post a few down from here, felt I was being a little too harsh on the manager, I don't hate the bloke, just want to see us get better, annoyed with our current situation.
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That's true lol.
I am and I make no apology for that.
The man made me believe again.
My first game was 86 after that first season where Pleat was so near and yet so far I've watched us steadily get shitter and shitter I've seen our most hated rivals a team that half my family support humiliate us time and time again.
We've been better in recent years if course and Poch cant take all the credit. Jol , Redknapp and of course Levy deserve thanks too but Poch changed everything for me.
We are now better than the scum, were top four regulars (remember us going mad when we got Europa?!), we have challenged for league titles, sure we didn't win but it wasn't so long ago that 8th was the best I could hope for and of course we reached the European cup final. Fuck me that's something I NEVER thought I'd see. All this in just a few years.
So yes I'm romantic about the man and his legacy. Maybe it is time to move on, I've said in other threads his heart doesn't seem like his in it and yes were a club that can now attract the best, but make no mistake that's in huge part thanks to him.
Do I find him infuriating at times? Of course but we win together and lose together. I see a man who has had so much love for our club looking a little lost and fed up. So whilst I wouldn't necessarily blame levy for parting ways I do have far too much love and admiration for Poch to demand his sacked. His record deserves my loyalty.
What legacy?
It tells me most fans realise the shambles we're seeing today has it's roots in the shambles that pretend to be running our football club.
Poch got fucked over by the board, and just as a few of us predicted on here, he's the one carrying the can now the wheels have fallen off
I think it's a bit of both mate. The old guard were class but have withered as they matured, the you're guard not up to genuine scratch and given too long to turn it around which has seen us with full of old legs, young grade B players propping them up and peak year stars carrying the lot of them.
Half of our team should have been moved on a long time ago and I feel we had done we would probably be sitting on an extra £400m for our troubles. At peak time we could have probably got £25m for Aurier, £40m for Trippier after the WC, £50m for Dier from a team like Man U throwing it about a few years back, £120m for Eriksen, probably about £40m for Rose around the time Walker got sold, £60m for Toby a couple of season ago possibly, £20m for Wanyama etc.
It's all hindsight of course and it's not said with an accusing finger, I just see what Ferguson did when he held no prisoners and used his instinct to say it's time for a change with some players and he did so whilst getting good money back on them. We haven't trusted our judgement enough, haven't been open to being branded a 'selling club' through risk of ridicule and it's left us with a potential £300m-£400m to revinvest dwindling down to perhaps £60m-£75m in reality.
We have taken our eye off the ball with analysing how players are getting on both productivity wise and with their fitness and mentality and it's left us with a lot that need replacing and not a lot we can make from the players we can sell.
Ultimately poor management at some level has seen us go stale.
It's the law of the jungle. We talk about who is ultimately to blame on here (Joe/Levy/Poch) but it carries little weight....whenever a football team is in trouble the manager is first against the wall. Not always fair but then life isn't. The big question is at what point does the team have to be at before the trigger is pulled ?
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I'd say the trigger will only be pulled if Levy sees the anger of the fan base turning on him. I've no doubt he'd then act decisively to get them back on board.
But the reason I don't want to see Poch sacked is because it just gives a free pas to ENIC to continue with their current formula. A formula that puts the balance sheet ahead of everything else.
I'm ok with Poch walking. Because that puts the spotlight back on ENIC.
Long term that would probably be worth the short term pain.
And I'm ok with him staying. Because long term, so long as we have to operate under the current model, I dont see any other manager getting us back into the top 4 or another champions league final.
I agree with you regarding ENIC. Once the manager goes what happens next will show exactly where Daniel's loyalties lie, the football club or the balance sheet. He will hang on grimly to Poch in order to avoid that situation for as long as he can. The worry is that if he is eventually forced to sack him, where will the team be by the time that happens ?
Here's one for you John. I don't agree with your mindset but let's just say you are right with Levy and the board etc.
At what stage do the club say that top 4 isn't possible and weigh up the profit/ loss involved in being realistic when it comes to our status this season and the financial cost of ditching Poch? If the club has contingency plans and prepares financially for Champions League doomsday then do they look at keeping Poch purely from a financial perspective and see giving him another go as a more sensible and financially viable option?
I don't agree with you regarding it but if they are all for profit and see us as 10 points behind, when weighing up risk the performance of other teams and our percentages when it comes to surpassing them domestically would surely come into the equation right? I'm interested to hear your thoughts on a possible decision making process and the reasoning behind it seeing as you're at the other end of the spectrum to me on ENIC pal.
Edit, just so you know, we are currently joint 5th favourites for top 4, with Skybet at 5/2 so we are no longer seen as favourites to secure the money spinning top 4. With the odds now AGAINST us, what does profit margin Levy opt for? By the same token, if Levy does pull the trigger with us no longer seen as favourites for a top 4 slot does this debunk your views on him being purely for profit?
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They appointed Poch in the hope he could achieve regular CL football on a budget dwarfed by our competitors. He did that consistently and ahead of schedule.
Poch's aspirations then grew, but Levy's didn't, so now we're in the situation we find ourselves in today.
So I think Levy is now in a quandry.
He realises his best bet is hoping Poch turns things around and gets us fighting in the top 6 or 7 for the next few seasons while a gradual rebuild gets underway.
I think he realises the cost of building this team into immediate CL contenders again outweighs the cost of missing out on top 4.
Therefore, he'll hold on to Poch as long as possible.
He knows there's no chance of attracting the likes of Pep, Klopp ,Mourinho or any other serial winners, so I think he's written off this season and the next couple as well.
In fact, that could explain Pochs current demeanour. He knows he's safe.
Makes a lot of sense as Poch doesn't seem to concerned with things as they stand. Appreciate the response, I'm going to take a right good look at the companies accounts when the new ones come out, compile the last ten years or so's worth and let you and all the other fighting cocks know exactly how much the club is sitting on since ENIC took over. In fact I may just have a look at this shit now if I can dig it out!
Our squad is capable of so much more than what they're currently giving. Levy bears partial responsibility for that, but Poch should be getting way more out of this squad than what he's currently managing.
Annual Reports | Tottenham Hotspur
Find out about and download previous Annual Reports for Tottenham Hotspur dating back until 2006 and Interim Reports between 2006 and 2010.
www.tottenhamhotspur.com
30 June 2018 - £113m (CL)
30 June 2017 - £41.2m (CL)
30 June 2016 - £33m
30 June 2015 - £9.4m
30 June 2014 - £65.3m
30 June 2013 - £1.5m
30 June 2012 - £4.3m LOSS
30 June 2011 - £0.7m
30 June 2010 - £22.7m (CL)
30 June 2009 - £18.4m
30 June 2008 - £1m
30 June 2007 - £19m
30 June 2006 - £2m LOSS
Interesting quick skim. We've made a loss during the ENIC reign twice since 2006 and after taxation and interest paid, since 2016 we currently have only surpassed £10m profit for the year 7 times out of a recorded 13 years. Over half of our seasons have seen us fail to make a profit over £10m
As it stands though we have apparently got a culminative overall profit since 2006 that stands at £318.9m. I may have done this wrong as it's a very quick skim and I'm not an accountant but it seems like if we take away our Champions League seasons, which the club have always said they safeguard, the clubs profits from 2006 are a total of £142m.
Overall it's a £318.9m profit from what I can see across 13 seasons. Roughly an average of £24.5m profit on average each season. That average comes down to £14.2m retained profit per season if we don't include the Champions League seasons as the club have said they won't. What are your thoughts? Prudent business and contingency plans as football finance inflates or skimming off the top?
I hope not. I enjoy this forum and I hope Joe doesn't mean me.
Thank you sir.
I think we already know the answer about his loyalties. The guy is a first class shit who is expanding his real estate empire on the backs of our lads. I really can't see it any other way. If our crowds shrink and the profits lessen, he'll try to sell us off like a second hand car. What a loathsome creep.
Add me to the list of weak-willed fairweathers...but I'm on the Poch out side now. It's over. That's not fun, but it's better to be realistic about it.
There's no sense sacking him now, who would we appoint...Sherwood?! But he should go in the summer, one way or the other. He took his shot, and it was glorious at times....but it came up short and it's clear that he either lacks the energy or ability to rebuild and reinvent.
Mad to think its come to this given that over his time we're a handful of results away from being league champions twice, winning the CL, and bagging a few domestic cups. Change about a dozen matches, and we'd be naming the fucking stadium after him.
There's no sense sacking him now, who would we appoint...Sherwood?! But he should go in the summer, one way or the other. He took his shot, and it was glorious at times....but it came up short and it's clear that he either lacks the energy or ability to rebuild and reinvent.
Mad to think its come to this given that over his time we're a handful of results away from being league champions twice, winning the CL, and bagging a few domestic cups. Change about a dozen matches, and we'd be naming the fucking stadium after him.