Not keen on an outsider buying us, all we are is the latest toy. Hope ENIC stay put, at least for the foreseeable future.
-
The Fighting Cock is a forum for fans of Tottenham Hotspur Football Club. Here you can discuss Spurs latest matches, our squad, tactics and any transfer news surrounding the club. Registration gives you access to all our forums (including 'Off Topic' discussion) and removes most of the adverts (you can remove them all via an account upgrade). You're here now, you might as well...
Latest Spurs videos from Sky Sports
Melters and moaners can slag him off all they like, but we have a spurs FAN at the helm (an increasing rarity in the upper eschelons of the modern game)... I'd rather it stayed that way.
A multi-billion dollar company? No.
Not even sure it'd be that smart. We're divisive about trivial issues, imagine the furore over real shit.
Not even sure it'd be that smart. We're divisive about trivial issues, imagine the furore over real shit.
Carlito is minted apparently, maybe he could front the first 50 mil?
why don't we just go on there tell Deborah to fuck off and make us a sandwhich while the men talk business, then do a dash-n-grab all the wads on their tables, laugh our way back down to tottenham and spunk it all on strippers, gear and beer.
I think the bolded bit is the biggest problem with your outlook - there doesn't exist a multi billionaire owner who's main focus is success on the pitch. Primarily because one doesn't become a multi-billionaire by inordinately focussing one's attention on something with such narrow, fluxuating, and largely uncontrollable profit margins as football.
You could argue that Citeh and PSG do, but then you're into discussing inheireted, entitled wealth and whether or not actually winning is the intention or the storefront to something more dubious. For everyone else, owning a football club is largely vanity entangled with property development and the potential to leverage ownership of a football club/stadium and membership in an exclusive club to the benefit of other business interests.
Even Abramovich was clearly in it for the benefits of redeveloping a massive chunk of London real estate, and after his plans for sites like Battersea went tits up and he's faced hus immigration struggles he's pretty much stopped putting money into the club.
There's certainly no one operating a club at the level you/we aspire to that is owned by an individual focused on on-pitch results. The days of top clubs being owned by local boys made good who attend every match and sign blank cheques for the manager in hopes of winning glory are gone.
Deleted member 13260
Guest
I thinkJohn Thomas is spot on (I may need to lie down), having the best stadium, best run club, etc is all well and good however, one trophy in 20 years is NOT what top clubs should be achieving.
So had we won the champions league, suddenly the club has been run well for the past 20 years or so?
We aren't a top club. That's what I think Levy is changing.
Now, I know you'd never refer to me as a melter or a moaner, but the real man at the helm, as I'm sure you're aware, is Joe Lewis.
He's not and never has been a football fan, let alone a Spurs fan.
I'm not knocking you're unbridled support for Daniel Levy here, that's your prerogative. But if you think ENIC are in the game for the love of Spurs rather than long term profit on their investment then your showing a huge amount of naivity.
Personally, I'd prefer a multi billionaire owner (like we have) who's main focus is success on the pitch, rather than recording record breaking financial results each year. 1 league cup in 2 decades is pretty shameful if we're honest.
But I guess we all have different ideas on the meaning of success
Todd Boehly has lost interest says my ITK
He spent 10 minutes looking on this forum and thought "f**k that", i'll get into Opera
He spent 10 minutes looking on this forum and thought "f**k that", i'll get into Opera
I think
John Thomas
is spot on (I may need to lie down), having the best stadium, best run club, etc is all well and good however, one trophy in 20 years is NOT what top clubs should be achieving.
John Thomas
is spot on (I may need to lie down), having the best stadium, best run club, etc is all well and good however, one trophy in 20 years is NOT what top clubs should be achieving.There are salient points in this debate but it is nowhere near as binary as it appears.
Levy/Joe Lewis are not Spurs fans like any contributor here, they are invested though. If you want to be clinical, they want the club to be successful so that when they sell it, it will have the highest return on investment. So while they may have selfish motivations, they're not evil and they compare very favourably to other investor's strategies and individual chairmen. Long and short of it, the club's value is defined by it's fans, it's ability to garner sponsorship and it's on the field performance.
I have written way too much about this and if anyone wants a bit more of an insight on that, there is the article 'Now is Not the Time', which is less of a car crash than the following thread debate on here!
ENIC have been here 20 years but the first time we saw the Champions League in the modern football era was 2010-11 season, so we only started looking like a major club within the last 8 years. I accept we could have and perhaps should have won a couple more trophies in that time. It's also kind of reductive to argue or rue the things you didn't get. You can only focus on what goes next.
The record profit comment is odd, the idea it should inspire either pride or shame is just irrelevant. The club needs to make money because of the debts it will have to service, also, some of that will be spent on player investment, we have just made our record signing you know? Again, there is no point getting angry over not signing players or, worst still attributing blame, I could make well rounded arguments that put the blame at ENIC's or Pochettino's door, given enough time, I'm sure I could make a case for 'Global Warming', 'Brexit' or the 'The delayed finale of Game of Thrones', the only truth I can tell you is that we're speculating because none of us know. Much like if we had of made signings that they would have tangibly changed the outcomes of our season.
I also think anyone saying that the only money a club should ever spend is on players, transfer fees and lucrative contracts, everything else must be considered secondary. As much as we want the best possible squad, how does that make sense if you're not doing other things, like the building projects and the building of the infrastructure to take the club up to the next level?
I take a pragmatic view, ENIC are not deity or something that requires blind worship but it is equally harsh to say they have not been a good custodian of the club. Could anyone argue that the club is in a worse state than they found it in?
Levy/Joe Lewis are not Spurs fans like any contributor here, they are invested though. If you want to be clinical, they want the club to be successful so that when they sell it, it will have the highest return on investment. So while they may have selfish motivations, they're not evil and they compare very favourably to other investor's strategies and individual chairmen. Long and short of it, the club's value is defined by it's fans, it's ability to garner sponsorship and it's on the field performance.
I have written way too much about this and if anyone wants a bit more of an insight on that, there is the article 'Now is Not the Time', which is less of a car crash than the following thread debate on here!
ENIC have been here 20 years but the first time we saw the Champions League in the modern football era was 2010-11 season, so we only started looking like a major club within the last 8 years. I accept we could have and perhaps should have won a couple more trophies in that time. It's also kind of reductive to argue or rue the things you didn't get. You can only focus on what goes next.
The record profit comment is odd, the idea it should inspire either pride or shame is just irrelevant. The club needs to make money because of the debts it will have to service, also, some of that will be spent on player investment, we have just made our record signing you know? Again, there is no point getting angry over not signing players or, worst still attributing blame, I could make well rounded arguments that put the blame at ENIC's or Pochettino's door, given enough time, I'm sure I could make a case for 'Global Warming', 'Brexit' or the 'The delayed finale of Game of Thrones', the only truth I can tell you is that we're speculating because none of us know. Much like if we had of made signings that they would have tangibly changed the outcomes of our season.
I also think anyone saying that the only money a club should ever spend is on players, transfer fees and lucrative contracts, everything else must be considered secondary. As much as we want the best possible squad, how does that make sense if you're not doing other things, like the building projects and the building of the infrastructure to take the club up to the next level?
I take a pragmatic view, ENIC are not deity or something that requires blind worship but it is equally harsh to say they have not been a good custodian of the club. Could anyone argue that the club is in a worse state than they found it in?
Last edited:
This is just a proposal and a kite in the sky to see what could be achieved but here is the scenario.
Man United fans are currently paying the loan off the glazers took out to buy Man U through general trading. What if you cut out the middle man. Tottenham fan base has a lot of financial expertise within its numbers. What if we could raise a vehicle that paid off ENIC then awarded 2 votes to season ticket holders 1 vote to members and the loan would be paid off through general trading. The terms of which would be fully explained. The club would then belong to it's fans. Stadium plans would be transparent i.e. admitting we can or cant afford it. We could vote the board in on 3 year cycle. With a yearly AGM. No dividend would ever be issued. All profits ploughed back into the club or into cheaper tickets.
I have no idea if this can work or if is even viable it's a discussion piece but it would at least warrant an examination. Could you imagine spurs owed by it's fans fighting for it's fans maybe even being honest with it's fans.
COYS
Man United fans are currently paying the loan off the glazers took out to buy Man U through general trading. What if you cut out the middle man. Tottenham fan base has a lot of financial expertise within its numbers. What if we could raise a vehicle that paid off ENIC then awarded 2 votes to season ticket holders 1 vote to members and the loan would be paid off through general trading. The terms of which would be fully explained. The club would then belong to it's fans. Stadium plans would be transparent i.e. admitting we can or cant afford it. We could vote the board in on 3 year cycle. With a yearly AGM. No dividend would ever be issued. All profits ploughed back into the club or into cheaper tickets.
I have no idea if this can work or if is even viable it's a discussion piece but it would at least warrant an examination. Could you imagine spurs owed by it's fans fighting for it's fans maybe even being honest with it's fans.
COYS
Last edited:
Can't see Levy/Lewis/ENIC selling yet. They'll want to have a full season in the new stadium I would think to increase brand and therefore value.
At this point I think everyone owns part of the Dodgers. I got some shares when I bought a large fountain drink at LAX.
To your point, but more bluntly:
City and PSG are propaganda machines for countries with horrible human rights abuses.
Chelsea was purchased as part of a money-laundering machine for Putin through Abramovich.
This is not a standard we should hope to emulate. I'd much prefer the Liverpool route of smart management and adequate resources. I think we are trying to tread a similar path.
I'd like to think that while Lewis simply sees us simply as a financial profit, Levy also sees Tottenham as a financial investement, but also wants to see us succeed. To be honest, there are few owners out there who I would trade for Levy. He's a complete moron and a pain in the arse for everyone that has to do business deals with him, but he's our moron. Now, some would argue that he is not a good owner, but he/we just hit the jackpot with Poch. While this is true, we still are a brand that is rising drastically and is doing it THE RIGHT WAY. There are only a few owners who are on par with ENIC for me (Agnelli family of Juve, De Laurentiis of Napoli and Perez of Real Madrid.) We should consider ourselves lucky that we don't have owners like that lot down the road do, or Newcastle, or Bolton, or Blackpool etc... And it's better that we don't have plastic owners like City and PSG too, because this has meant that we have risen while keeping our club soul alive...
So the fans can own the club....
...complaint about managers being sacked when the fans are calling for it?....
....and blame each other for not investing?
:gomes:
I think people underestimate the business ability of the guy in charge?
You only have to look back on threads on here and think "thank fuck none of us are making the decisions!"
A season ticket also does not equate to any common sense too.
Nice idea, in reality....Noooooooooo:lamelashock:
...complaint about managers being sacked when the fans are calling for it?....
....and blame each other for not investing?
:gomes:
I think people underestimate the business ability of the guy in charge?
You only have to look back on threads on here and think "thank fuck none of us are making the decisions!"
A season ticket also does not equate to any common sense too.
Nice idea, in reality....Noooooooooo:lamelashock:
Fan ownership models are working in Germany and aren't the 2 Spanish giants Madrid & Barcelona fan owned.
You vote in a board who report back it's not voting each week to see who puts out the cones in training.
You vote in a board who report back it's not voting each week to see who puts out the cones in training.