Tanguy Ndombele

[Deuterz]

We sometimes blame our window of no transactions for our bad state now, but it still shocks me that we then had a window with a 150m outlay with nothing to show for it two years on: Ndombele is good for a half every now and then, Lo Celso has shown us nothing in forever, Sessegnon shows no signs of being a first team player, and Clarke can’t even get on the pitch when we play against farmers.

Ndombele is the worst of them all, because when he is on the pitch and not gassed, he so clearly makes us better. It’s the worst kind of tease.

Yeah, it was an utter waste of money. What makes it even more depressing is we haggled over Grealish the summer before and ended up missing out, and then also haggled over Fernandes and missed out.

The investment hasn't been good enough. But our scouting department is arguably even more disgraceful. I have no idea how Ndombele was ever even given the nod in the first place when I know for a fact there were big questions marks over his fitness/attitude at Lyon. And we expected him to be fine with Pochettino's military style fitness regime! We also knew Lo Celso had been very disappointing for PSG, and playing as an attacking midfielder in Spain is completely different to playing as one in England.

Sessegnon may well be the worst of the bunch. I watched him at Fulham, nearly every game when he was in the championship. He had a fantastic knack for being in the right place at the right time, but almost nothing beyond that.

 

[iz futbal]

You're not understanding the point.

I don't care how our goals came, my point is that we will always look solid in a midfield pairing of Hojbjerg and Skipp and you can count on them to get us through matches more than you can count on Ndombele regardless of the performance.

You cant just playing someone because you can 'count on them'. If we had 5 DMs that you can count on that doesnt mean we forget the attackers that you cant count on as much and have all defensive players on the pitch. We still have to score goals.

 

[Deuterz]

You're not understanding the point.

I don't care how our goals came, my point is that we will always look solid in a midfield pairing of Hojbjerg and Skipp and you can count on them to get us through matches more than you can count on Ndombele regardless of the performance.

You can count on them consistently playing predictable, plodding football in areas which allow opposition defenders to pretty much pull up a chair and relax. And opposition midfields with any technical ability or athleticism will still bully them out of games.

Both of those started in a game where Palace had 63% of the ball and we had 2 shots in an entire match, in a game where even before the red card we were managing to make one of the most average central midfields in the PL look like Xavi, Iniesta and Busquets.

If Skipp and Hojbjerg are the answer, we might as well wave the white flag right now.

 

[The Mercurial No.10]

Dele played a great ball through for arguably our best chance to score and finished 90 mins.

 

[Shadydan]

You can count on them consistently playing predictable, plodding football in areas which allow opposition defenders to pretty much pull up a chair and relax. And opposition midfields with any technical ability or athleticism will still bully them out of games.

Both of those started in a game where Palace had 63% of the ball and we had 2 shots in an entire match, in a game where even before the red card we were managing to make one of the most average central midfields in the PL look like Xavi, Iniesta and Busquets.

If Skipp and Hojbjerg are the answer, we might as well wave the white flag right now.

I thought the Palace game we started with a midfield 3 with Skipp, Hojbjerg and Winks?

The fact is that they have played together with each other and have seemingly given us a platform in the first 3 matches and it's a hell of a lot more that what Ndombele can give us or any wishful thinking on your part, you might not like the football but we stand a better chance of winning football matches at the moment with them in as opposed to Ndombele, this is a fact.

 

[Shadydan]

You cant just playing someone because you can 'count on them'. If we had 5 DMs that you can count on that doesnt mean we forget the attackers that you cant count on as much and have all defensive players on the pitch. We still have to score goals.

?

 

[Deuterz]

I thought the Palace game we started with a midfield 3 with Skipp, Hojbjerg and Winks?

The fact is that they have played together with each other and have seemingly given us a platform in the first 3 matches and it's a hell of a lot more that what Ndombele can give us or any wishful thinking on your part, you might not like the football but we stand a better chance of winning football matches at the moment with them in as opposed to Ndombele, this is a fact.

What platform did they give us? Against City the midfield was bypassed entirely. We had 34% of the ball and scored from a pot shot. We sneaked past Watford at home via a free kick their keeper fumbled in, and then produced the worst performance I have ever seen from a Spurs team against Palace, in which they utterly dominated our midfield and the ball. I also struggle to see what platform they provided in the 2nd half vs Chelsea.

The football isn't entertaining OR productive, that's the problem. Hojbjerg is fine and does his job but you can't then stick a couple of work horses next to him and expect results. Every PL team has workhorses, but 95% of them also have midfielders who can influence games.

Wishful thinking is expecting to consistently create enough chances to win games with those two in midfield. Ndombele was a key part of the best string of Spurs performances we've seen since Pochettino. He is our only central midfielder who can pick a pass or beat his man, the only one other midfielders would be even slightly concerned about.

We need to get him fit and playing regularly, or we are completely lost. That's not hope, it's just facts, i'll admit relying on Ndombele as our midfield saviour isn't a perfect scenario, but its the situation we've been left in.

 

[iz futbal]

?

:mourfacepalm:

 

[Shadydan]

What platform did they give us? Against City the midfield was bypassed entirely. We had 34% of the ball and scored from a pot shot. We sneaked past Watford at home via a free kick their keeper fumbled in, and then produced the worst performance I have ever seen from a Spurs team against Palace, in which they utterly dominated our midfield and the ball. I also struggle to see what platform they provided in the 2nd half vs Chelsea.

The football isn't entertaining OR productive, that's the problem. Hojbjerg is fine and does his job but you can't then stick a couple of work horses next to him and expect results. Every PL team has workhorses, but 95% of them also have midfielders who can influence games.

Wishful thinking is expecting to consistently create enough chances to win games with those two in midfield. Ndombele was a key part of the best string of Spurs performances we've seen since Pochettino. He is our only central midfielder who can pick a pass or beat his man, the only one other midfielders would be even slightly concerned about.

We need to get him fit and playing regularly, or we are completely lost. That's not hope, it's just facts, i'll admit relying on Ndombele as our midfield saviour isn't a perfect scenario, but its the situation we've been left in.

They gave us a platform to stay in the match, hence why we were able to win those matches? That's what a solid midfield pairing will do. Most Premier League teams have players who can influence games but they aren't blowing out their arse after 40 mins.

Yeah I get all this about him, I've heard it all before - he's the only midfielder with real quality, he can break the lines etc...but that doesn't take away from the fact that he's only useful for 40% of the match...I mean what's the plan here? To play him in every first half in the hope he creates something then sub him off and go to plan B?

You say we need to get him fit? We signed Ndombele in 2019, since then he's played under 4 coaches. he's played 77 times for Spurs and only completed 90 mins 14 times, when is it going to sink in, this guy is a bust, if he can't get fit after 2 fucking years of being at the club then what hope do we have for him?

 

[Distaste for scouse]

Would you hire a reverend who won't work Sundays?

No, so why defend a footballer who can't complete 90 minutes of football? 2 years of this shit now and more excuses.

It's a joke that's its been allowed to carry on this long, fuck knows what its doing to the dressing room dynamic.

 

[sudoku]

Any word from Milan...sorry Madrid or Paris?
In the last game he beat 3 players down the left and turned round and passed it back.
Done the identical move today.

 

[Deuterz]

They gave us a platform to stay in the match, hence why we were able to win those matches? That's what a solid midfield pairing will do. Most Premier League teams have players who can influence games but they aren't blowing out their arse after 40 mins.

Yeah I get all this about him, I've heard it all before - he's the only midfielder with real quality, he can break the lines etc...but that doesn't take away from the fact that he's only useful for 40% of the match...I mean what's the plan here? To play him in every first half in the hope he creates something then sub him off and go to plan B?

You say we need to get him fit? We signed Ndombele in 2019, since then he's played under 4 coaches. he's played 77 times for Spurs and only completed 90 mins 14 times, when is it going to sink in, this guy is a bust, if he can't get fit after 2 fucking years of being at the club then what hope do we have for him?

They didn't though. We got dominated against Wolves and City. We won those games because we defended heroically and took our chances, it was nothing to do with the midfield at all. In both games we had far less possession, and created less chances. It was up front and at the back where we were competent. As soon as that changed (against Palace) we saw the same thing happen but got destroyed.

And honestly, I mostly am in agreement. I don't think the chances of getting much out of him are high, but I do think that the small % chance he gets it together is more likely to be successful than the other options. He played plenty under Jose, managed to get decent minutes under his belt, and was more productive than Skipp and Winks combined.

We need to get him looking somewhat competent. We know that's possible. Then we can at least try to dupe someone in to buying him in the summer and invest his significant wages in to a player who is both talented and doesn't have a terrible attitude. My wish would be Potter in the summer and bring Bissouma with him.

Again, if we don't play him at all, he's going nowhere. We're stuck with his huge wages and no transfer fee. Let him audition for a transfer and cross our fingers that he does enough for someone to try, perhaps a club in a league where the pace is slower and they believe he can just do his thing.

 

[Essexyido94]

Waste of money so far.

 

[sudoku]

What pisses me off about him is he rarely does anything with the ball.
How many times today did he mug off a Chelsea player and then play a safe sideways or backwards pass?
Defensively he was great 1st half then completely threw the towel in 2nd half.
Let's hope he can be useful to us against the bottom half teams and then we can get some money back for him in January or next summer.

 

[The Mercurial No.10]

Any word from Milan...sorry Madrid or Paris?
In the last game he beat 3 players down the left and turned round and passed it back.
Done the identical move today.

There'll be a highlight reel being compiled right now by some virginal Football Manager playing, amateur psuedo-scouting, geek dickhead who's never kicked a ball in their lives calling him Ndomballer etc.

Someone will post it, hope they include the pointless show-offy flick.

 

[Spursidol]

33 premier League games for us last season - only 6 times he played 90 minutes.
21 premier League games for us in 19/20 season - only 3 times he played 90 minutes.

So over 2 seasons played 54 PL games - but only 9 times completed 90 minutes

When he arrived at start of 19/20 for a full preseason, Poch said he was not fit, overweight etc and most of the time started him but yanked him off after 45 mins or 60 mins.


Nothing seems to have changed, pulled off after 60 minutes today (with Lo Celso). I think Nuno has to plan to play Ndombele for 60 mins and then replace him by someone - possibly Lo Celso who also has a problem playing a full 90 minutes and indeed doesn't seem to be able to reproduce his Betis creativity and attacking form in the more intense PL.

The pair of them costing £100m and on big wages is a huge problem (especially when Poch turned down Bruno Fernandes to sign the Argentine Lo Celso), and I think one or both have to be moved on in summer 2022, if we can find a buyer ..... which will not be easy on their wages and to get any sort of transfer fee to reinvest in the squad.

 

[Stag]

and then play a safe sideways or backwards pass?

this seems endemic across our entire midfield now. we never play the pass behind the oppo back 4, none of that sliderule stuff - very occasionally someone will try a little ping over the two oppo centrehalves heads but thats about it.

the team as a whole are scared to try things, scared to play football

 

[Airfixx]

Hes not fit enough for a full 90. But its better to have 1 good half from him than two shit ones from the replacements

Like it or loath it (and I'm more loath than like); 4231 with a midfield being:

PEH / Skipp
XXX / Ndombele / XXX​

...And let Dele & Gio battle it out for the 60minute sub of Tanguy.

 

[JDK]

Just play Lo Celso-Hojbjerg-Ndombele in a regular midfield three for a long run of games. It might be ugly for a little bit, but that’s the only group in terms of talent and balance that is a top 4 quality midfield. Let them get comfortable with each other. Dele and Skipp are solid subs for where we’re at.

If it doesn’t work out, at least we’ll know it wasn’t to be.

 

[meaningless-friendly]

Like it or loath it (and I'm more loath than like); 4231 with a midfield being:

PEH / Skipp
XXX / Ndombele / XXX​

...And let Dele & Gio battle it out for the 60minute sub of Tanguy.

I think more along these lines as well. Take away his defensive duties, or minimise them, and get him in positions where he can create.

Maybe 3 at the back and Ndombele as a number 10 behind Kane and Son?

Lloris
Tanganga Romero Dier
Royale Hojbjerg Skipp Reguilon
Ndombele
Kane Son
​

To be honest, this is still a shit team, the wing-backs aint good enough (Reg is average and Royale looks no good at all so far). But as a vehicle for Ndombele, it might work to a degree.