Chelsea v Tottenham Hotspur (A) Sat., 22.2.2020 (12:30)

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On a positive note I thought Coco did well when he came on, didn’t give their players time to pick a pass and move it upfield/defend. He gets a lot of stick from us but at least he gives it his all when able.
 
We were fucking awful today. Plenty of passion and effort from many of the boys but we are not a good side at the moment. Everything continues to look laboured.
Pile of fucking shit is being fair I think.
 
We averaged a point a game for nearly a year building up to Mourinho. Do you honestly think that he would click his fingers and everything would be great again? We had no confidence, no belief, no foundations we were able to develop from it's all about an incremental process.

Points first, then confidence, then rhythm, then you build on it isn't how I saw the process going. Up until the news of Sonny's injury we were only bettered by Liverpool for points won in the Prem since Jose took over. Like it or not that's impressive for where we were as a club when he took over.

It's a massive shame that we won't get to see how the teams style progressed with on song Lo Celso, Ndombele, Dele, Son, Bergwijn and Kane. Won't be seeing those 6 starting a game together for the first time until August at the earliest it seems.

I get some of that, but that wasn’t my point. You were saying that we were always going to struggle to perform well without Kane and Son, but we were just as tactically inept and performed just as badly (worse maybe) in the home game, with them.

so our performance today wasn’t really all about who was missing, it was just the same tactical approach, without them.

I don’t completely follow your logic either. Surely if you are looking to build sustainable success, first you develop your style/identity and performances (and performance levels), get the team looking cohesive and balanced, then you hope that points come from these things being “right” consistently.

I would happily write off some results and their consequences if I could see evidence that we were becoming a well functioning team again. What I’m seeing is us becoming a passive (not even passive aggressive), reactive type of team, who’s philosophy seems to be sit tight and hope to skank something against “decent” sides, or hope that our superior individual attacking players can out score lesser sides.

In his heyday, even his more pragmatic sides were at least aggressive and cohesive, and incredibly frugal. That’s not what we are seeing currently.

I accept that Mourinho needs to be more comprehensively judged after the summer and into next season when he’s had a pre season. But we can only call what we see in the interim can’t we?
 
A few observations:
Some people just accept the defeat bcos we always lose that’s no excuse
He moaned about Davis being injured as if it was key to how we play but his been shite check villa first goal
If we play 3 at the back then we need attacking WBs that should be serge and sess
He instils mo confidence in the players first when Kane was injured he said we have no one to replace him them when Son gets injured we nowvhave no strikers. His duping everyone to think we can’t play any other way but we were crap when son was fit and even when Kane was fitvwe played some shocking stuff check Brighton home game Norwich away.
I don’t think think his really bothered he can’t seem to motivate the players
We should have gone for Carlo or nuno at least we would continue with similar style of play
His style of play won’t change we were pretty much doing the same when son was fit and with Kane we just lumped it and conceded possession.
We have been virtually outplayed in every game and against the big teams we have been so small time instead of being positive.
For what his paid he should be thinking of solutions thinking outside the box rather just give up which basically he has can’t be good for players morale.
If we are going to park the bus at least make sure the players actually bother to defend we just let teams pass the ball around even in our penalty box.
I can see fans not going if we continue to play this style especially against lower teams
His negativity is killing us making everyone think this is all we can do. Defeatist attitude!
We have 8 days for next game what will be the excuse next time if we lose or play badly and mange a scrappy win?
He said wanted time with the players but when his had a week or more to prepare for a game we have been crap.
 
I get some of that, but that wasn’t my point. You were saying that we were always going to struggle to perform well without Kane and Son, but we were just as tactically inept and performed just as badly (worse maybe) in the home game, with them.

so our performance today wasn’t really all about who was missing, it was just the same tactical approach, without them.

I don’t completely follow your logic either. Surely if you are looking to build sustainable success, first you develop your style/identity and performances (and performance levels), get the team looking cohesive and balanced, then you hope that points come from these things being “right” consistently.

I would happily write off some results and their consequences if I could see evidence that we were becoming a well functioning team again. What I’m seeing is us becoming a passive (not even passive aggressive), reactive type of team, who’s philosophy seems to be sit tight and hope to skank something against “decent” sides, or hope that our superior individual attacking players can out score lesser sides.

In his heyday, even his more pragmatic sides were at least aggressive and cohesive, and incredibly frugal. That’s not what we are seeing currently.

I accept that Mourinho needs to be more comprehensively judged after the summer and into next season when he’s had a pre season. But we can only call what we see in the interim can’t we?
Evening, Bus Wanker.
 
Mate. It doesn't matter who we play up top. He will still set us up in a low or mid-block!!!

He's brainwashing everyone in thinking all is lost because we have THREE players injured! THREE!!!!

His style of football requires a striker to hold the ball up and lob long balls to, he's not adapting because he can't. Before we lost Son he defended his style of football by saying he couldn't play any differently because he lost Ban Davies!!
Exactly... You don't see OGS complaining about their injuries they are just getting on with it. We could have Ronaldo and Messi up front and would still struggle to score a goal. I am more concerned about how open we are at the back anyway.
 
I get some of that, but that wasn’t my point. You were saying that we were always going to struggle to perform well without Kane and Son, but we were just as tactically inept and performed just as badly (worse maybe) in the home game, with them.

so our performance today wasn’t really all about who was missing, it was just the same tactical approach, without them.

I don’t completely follow your logic either. Surely if you are looking to build sustainable success, first you develop your style/identity and performances (and performance levels), get the team looking cohesive and balanced, then you hope that points come from these things being “right” consistently.

I would happily write off some results and their consequences if I could see evidence that we were becoming a well functioning team again. What I’m seeing is us becoming a passive (not even passive aggressive), reactive type of team, who’s philosophy seems to be sit tight and hope to skank something against “decent” sides, or hope that our superior individual attacking players can out score lesser sides.

In his heyday, even his more pragmatic sides were at least aggressive and cohesive, and incredibly frugal. That’s not what we are seeing currently.

I accept that Mourinho needs to be more comprehensively judged after the summer and into next season when he’s had a pre season. But we can only call what we see in the interim can’t we?

Mourinho always said he wasn't able to get his points across during the season though, that he couldn't wait until the winter break where he'd be able to finally start to instil some of the new methods into the guys. That would have been drastically hindered with the loss of both his talismen though surely BC
 
Mourinho always said he wasn't able to get his points across during the season though, that he couldn't wait until the winter break where he'd be able to finally start to instil some of the new methods into the guys. That would have been drastically hindered with the loss of both his talismen though surely BC

As I said, he’ll be more comprehensively judged after he’s had a pre season. But that doesn’t meant he gets a completely free pass in the interim.

I think his tactics and application of them, and his first substitution were pretty fucking poor today.
 
As I said, he’ll be more comprehensively judged after he’s had a pre season. But that doesn’t meant he gets a completely free pass in the interim.

I think his tactics and application of them, and his first substitution were pretty fucking poor today.
A can and do agree with that. My issue is that he took a team on its knees, 13th place in the table up to 5th and gave us a points tally up until Sonny got injured that was only bettered by Liverpool since he took over. That doesn't mean he gets a free pass though, far from it for what we are paying him and the size of who we are. His judgement started the moment he took over, it's just that I feel he's done reasonably well given all the circumstances involved BC but that's just opinion and will vary per fan.
 
A few observations:
Some people just accept the defeat bcos we always lose that’s no excuse
He moaned about Davis being injured as if it was key to how we play but his been shite check villa first goal
If we play 3 at the back then we need attacking WBs that should be serge and sess
He instils mo confidence in the players first when Kane was injured he said we have no one to replace him them when Son gets injured we nowvhave no strikers. His duping everyone to think we can’t play any other way but we were crap when son was fit and even when Kane was fitvwe played some shocking stuff check Brighton home game Norwich away.
I don’t think think his really bothered he can’t seem to motivate the players
We should have gone for Carlo or nuno at least we would continue with similar style of play
His style of play won’t change we were pretty much doing the same when son was fit and with Kane we just lumped it and conceded possession.
We have been virtually outplayed in every game and against the big teams we have been so small time instead of being positive.
For what his paid he should be thinking of solutions thinking outside the box rather just give up which basically he has can’t be good for players morale.
If we are going to park the bus at least make sure the players actually bother to defend we just let teams pass the ball around even in our penalty box.
I can see fans not going if we continue to play this style especially against lower teams
His negativity is killing us making everyone think this is all we can do. Defeatist attitude!
We have 8 days for next game what will be the excuse next time if we lose or play badly and mange a scrappy win?
He said wanted time with the players but when his had a week or more to prepare for a game we have been crap.

Were you one of the ones happy when we sacked poch and got him in...at the time?
 
This business of Jose moaning - or “just stating facts”.. what do you think that does to the players, what do they think when they hear that? Probably they think that it’s not worth trying, apparently we’re fucked anyway......?
Often, in sport as in life, it’s attitude that makes the difference.
 
Really disappointed with the lack of heart today.

From a tactical perspective - with Toby, Sanchez and Jan at the back, I think we should have had Davinson in the middle. His pace can cover for the other two.
 
I actually thought we defended far better today than against Leipzig. Hugo only had to make a couple saves today. Against Leipzig I think he made 5 in the first 15 minutes alone, we were all over the shop. Chelsea are shite but still we didn't really look threatened for most of the game.
 
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