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This is true. But ending up as a serial winner when you've been at Espanyol and Soton is hardly easy.
Poch did himself no favours talking down the cups though. He should have gone more gung-ho for a at least one cup a season. Maybe we could have ended up with 1-2 throphies during his era.
Mourinho though, is at a different level when it comes to winning, he has been there so many times before. That means something for the players too.
Ole has now conceded more goals at home this season than Jose Mourinho did in the whole of the 2017:18 season. In 18 less games. “Ole has transformed the defence”
No it's not, the end of the 15/16 season was humiliating. We lost 5-1 to 10 man relegated Newcastle in a game that would have secured 2nd place and let Woolwich take it instead. Poch said later that he "wanted to kill all the players and then myself".
So yeah, we did finish 3rd in a 2 horse race and Poch knew it. Thankfully we had our best ever season after that.
Yeah load of crap. Not defending Poch or anything but put these facts right if you want a proper debate.
1. Poch has won nothing in 3 jobs - because 2 of them were with bottom half clubs. In Spain it’s extremely difficult to win Copa del Rey (cause title talk is hilarious if you’re not one of the top clubs). Look at the past winners in the cup to see how many clubs bar Real Madrid, Barcelona and Atletico have won it.
2. His third job wasn’t exactly in a great spot to start. I really hate when fans forget how bad we were before he took over. And it took him a season to sort that mess out. Another season to make a top 4 finish which was the main objectivr initially, remember? We weren’t supposed to win the fucking title, it’s just a shame that we couldn’t. Then yeah, we challenged for another title, FA Cup, Champions League but unfortunately we couldn’t cross the finish line as winners. First Champions League final in our club’s history man. I will never forget it even if it ended in tears. “Bbbbb but we didn’t win it”.
Mourinho took over a team that was broken? Yeah sure, a team that ended as Europe’s second best team the season before. This team wasn’t broken but it needed a change. The only “broke” excuse is that we had shitloads of injuries. And we only needed time to get over that spell of bad luck. Luckily for Mourinho, the lockdown put a halt on the season so most of the key players recovered from their injuries and battled for an EL spot.
Mourinho inherited a very talented squad. And added to it in the summer. So far we haven’t won anything under Mourinho either, it’s a very long way to go. Let’s talk after we win something, ok?
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Absolutely. What he did in those 2015-16, and 2016-17 seasons was remarkable.
In each season we were the only title challenger to the winner. My only complaint about losing out to Leicester was him not playing the kids in the early Europa rounds. We lost 7 points on those Sunday matches, including yet another pathetic defeat to the Barcodes when we'd even gone ahead. We came close to leading the table in a great run, but never did.
The team that REALLY screwed up that season was The Goons. They were top at Xmas and did the double over Leicester, 5-2 at Filbert. But they were nowhere near for the last few months. Really bad managing from Wenger.
Anyway, Poch and the cups.
I'll give you 3 examples where he screwed up.
1. League Cup Final 2015 v Mourinho's Chavs.
A real meh performance. But we had an away match on the Thursday (Fiorentina?) and he still played a strong team. Just sack that one off FFS, send the kids whatever, and spend the whole week on training to beat the Chavs. Give yourself the best chance.
2. Champions League final.
Kane starting? Surely start with the pace of Son and Moura, instruct them to run themselves into the ground for 60-70 mins, then sub one off and get Kane to see if he can find some space against a knackered back 4. And this is absolutely not hindsight.
3. Saints FA cup
My other half is a Saints fan so I took a bit of an interest in their cup run, 2014 I think.
They got to the 5th round, and get a plumb tie - away at a fast-imploding Sunderland. Should have been a shoe in for the QF. But no, let's play the reserves. WTF!!
Sunderland went through, but then beaten by Hull, a team that Saints had doubled in the PL. The semis that year were Hull, Wigan, Sheff Utd and the Goons. What a missed opportunity!!
I love the guy to bits, and I'll always be grateful for what he did, but boy did he have some blind spots. And those blind spots were instances where a different course of action was obvious to fans, let alone professional coaches.
We absolutely weren't 2nd best in Europe. From Jan onwards we'd been nearly the worst team in the PL, and combined with the start of the next season (and a fit squad) we were getting about a point a game, which is a relegation fight.
That CL run was great, but we lucked out something ridiculous on the way.
League table doesn't lie. And if you need a trend the last 10 matches or so will give an idea where you'll end up.
Poch's biggest mistake was at Southampton when he played a reserve team in the later stages of the FA Cup. He could have won it that year as it was a great opportunity.
This comment wasn't good the first time, certainly not good enough for twice.
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As we've all said already, Poch is a bit like Pep, great at building a playing style, drilling players in fitness and imposing the team's playstyle on the opposition.
And just like Pep, he doesn't have anything close to Mou's tactial knowledge, he can't see a game play out and understand why things are going right/wrong a lot of the time.
Poch would introduce a tactical idea and try to force it to work, whereas Mou is pretty quick to realise there's a flaw and adjust accordingly. Getting Sissoko to babysit Serge, dropping Dele from the squad, realising Sanchez and Foyth just weren't gonna cut it. Realising that Parrott and Skipp's minor roles in the squad weren't worth sacrificing real game time elsewhere.
Not to say he gets everything right but he's so much more decisive.
And just like Pep, he doesn't have anything close to Mou's tactial knowledge, he can't see a game play out and understand why things are going right/wrong a lot of the time.
Poch would introduce a tactical idea and try to force it to work, whereas Mou is pretty quick to realise there's a flaw and adjust accordingly. Getting Sissoko to babysit Serge, dropping Dele from the squad, realising Sanchez and Foyth just weren't gonna cut it. Realising that Parrott and Skipp's minor roles in the squad weren't worth sacrificing real game time elsewhere.
Not to say he gets everything right but he's so much more decisive.
Both Pochettino and Mourinho are the right guys for the stage the club was in.
Pochettino is one of the best builders in football - Jose isn’t capable of building that 14-19 team on that budget, With the stadium upheaval, and the very first thing Mourinho did when he arrived was to publicly thank Poch for the job he did, because without it, Tottenham Hotspur would not be at the level where he would’ve considered coming.
Mourinho is one of the best finishers in football - however since 2015 his reputation has taken a hit with the breakdowns at Chelsea and Man Utd. Spurs are now at the financial level which offers him a path to redemption. Achieving silverware with us would be a return to glory for him personally.
I was convinced that Mourinho was bad for us mainly because I thought we wouldn’t be competitive financially and ENIC wouldn’t change their level of support but it appears that Levy is pushing the boat out for Jose in a way he never has done for any of his previous managers. Levy has made a big call and unlike the Redknapp-to-AVB decision he’s actually supported it, and he played a big hand in fixing the division between N’Dombele and Mourinho.
Under previous Spurs managers a season like 19/20 would’ve been followed up with a big sale to compensate. Instead the main group has stuck together, Jose himself is more relaxed and malleable (maybe because he’s not in a hotel away from his family), and the players who came close under Poch are ready to follow the pied piper out of Hamlin. Long may these fortunate set of circumstances last, and that our club can Finally get over the line. It’s taken 17 years of organic growth and boy it will be sweet.
Pochettino is one of the best builders in football - Jose isn’t capable of building that 14-19 team on that budget, With the stadium upheaval, and the very first thing Mourinho did when he arrived was to publicly thank Poch for the job he did, because without it, Tottenham Hotspur would not be at the level where he would’ve considered coming.
Mourinho is one of the best finishers in football - however since 2015 his reputation has taken a hit with the breakdowns at Chelsea and Man Utd. Spurs are now at the financial level which offers him a path to redemption. Achieving silverware with us would be a return to glory for him personally.
I was convinced that Mourinho was bad for us mainly because I thought we wouldn’t be competitive financially and ENIC wouldn’t change their level of support but it appears that Levy is pushing the boat out for Jose in a way he never has done for any of his previous managers. Levy has made a big call and unlike the Redknapp-to-AVB decision he’s actually supported it, and he played a big hand in fixing the division between N’Dombele and Mourinho.
Under previous Spurs managers a season like 19/20 would’ve been followed up with a big sale to compensate. Instead the main group has stuck together, Jose himself is more relaxed and malleable (maybe because he’s not in a hotel away from his family), and the players who came close under Poch are ready to follow the pied piper out of Hamlin. Long may these fortunate set of circumstances last, and that our club can Finally get over the line. It’s taken 17 years of organic growth and boy it will be sweet.
Even without a financial backing from Levy, Mourinho would perform well. Don't forget that this guy won the Champions League with Porto.... That should speak for itself.
There seems to be a bit of a divide being drawn between those that were for and those that were/are against Poch. The last year was understandably a bad one, but if any of you cunts can think that, retrospectively, you knew Poch was wrong any earlier than the end of 2018, you’re a bigot. Plain and simple. There were mistakes, as there are anywhere. FA cup line ups, squad selection etc... but on the whole, regardless of what anyone says, I consider him to have been the most important and transformative influence on the team we could have hoped for at the time. And YES, I understand that someone else may have also been able to do it (or do it better) - but they didn’t in the reality we live in.... and I guarantee that many could have done a whole lot worse (imagine the damage Van Gaal could have done). If you look at where we were when AVB left and then applied one iota of reason, you’d consider Poch’s reign one of absolute transformation. I think he had to go but I’m very fucking grateful for what he gave us. Jose wouldn’t have looked at us as an option if we had ended up like United under Van Gaal.
Jose, I’m confident, will build on a confidence that Poch began to instil.
Jose, I’m confident, will build on a confidence that Poch began to instil.
When we lost 0-1 to West Ham and drew 2-2 with 10 man Woolwich who we were winning against, we could have gone top in both games if we'd won.
After the Woolwich game, still within touching distance with 9 games to go, we won 4.
We lost to Southamton and got hammered by Newcastle.
We drew to West Brom at home. We drew with Liverpool away when they scored in injury time.
We could have got that 2nd place by simply not being beat by Newcastle and we caved 5-1
No one was near us with 4 games to go when we took 2 TWO points from 12 TWELVE.
There were two games in those last 9 where we still looked like we'd win the league - 3-0 Vs Man U and 0-4 Vs Stoke we looked immense.
Then 2 points from 12.
We spent 13 matchdays in 2nd place and finished 3rd on the last day FFS.
3rd in a 2 horse race.