Why we need to stick with Poch

[mouse]

If the best reason anyone can come up with for sticking with the manager is stability/continuity then that is worrying.

Why? The whole point is that we haven't have seen enough yet to know whether he will be the right man long term. The sample size is too small and there are too many variables.

Worst case, we sack him after another 2-3 seasons minimum and we are in exactly the same position we are now.

 

[Bergmattsson]

We can't honestly expect to overtake two out of the current top 6 clubs whilst still balancing the checkbooks and sacking our managers after 18 months on the job.

We can't call our squad average and at the same time demand that our manager turns it into a Champions League-squad in no time and with no marquee-signings to help him.

I think we are prone to this. We want it all, and instantly. For us to really compete we need to SPEND. We spend plenty on players but it's always financed by selling our top players, which we then need to replace regardless. Poch has done okay for his 1st year. We were a bit shit for a while after a fine start, then we were really good for a period before sputtering out to some abysmal performances. We got two magnificent derby wins, we went to Wembley and we played some decent football at times. All this was done while fielding the league's youngest starting XI (on average) and with our third manager since the start of last season (it's majorly the same squad though) - all in all, decent.

Yes, Poch has some kinks to work on and we are far from the finished product but I have a hard time getting behind any argument for his departure. The fact that we are even somewhat seriously debating it all over this forum reflects poorly on us as a fanbase IMO. The man has done okay and should be given a second season unless we completely fall of the target (Europe) and/or the whole squad rebels against him.

 

[mouse]

The fact that we are even somewhat seriously debating all over this forum reflects poorly on us a fanbase IMO.

Agree 100%. Puts us in the same bracket as the Scousers and the Geordies. Fan bases that require instant gratification, and have an overriding sentiment that they have some fundamental right to be the best.

The Newcastle fans wanted Pardew out because they were adamant that the club could do better under a different manager. Look at them now.

 

[Eskimo]

The Newcastle fans wanted Pardew out because they were adamant that the club could do better under a different manager. Look at them now.

3 years ago today Robben missed his penalty and Bayern then went on to lose on penalies against a chelsea team that were in the final thanks to lionel messi missing a penalty, this culminated in us missing out on champions league qualification, a large percentage of our fans and indeed our chairman were adamant we could do better under a different manager. Look at us now.

 

[sammyspurs]

3 years ago today Robben missed his penalty and Bayern then went on to lose on penalies against a chelsea team that were in the final thanks to lionel messi missing a penalty, this culminated in us missing out on champions league qualification, a large percentage of our fans and indeed our chairman were adamant we could do better under a different manager. Look at us now.

Take a bow

 

[mouse]

Amazing, you can't argue with logic like that! It always comes back to Redknapp!

If only the man in question could see how much time was spent on here agonising over his dismissal, his ego would sky rocket. The irony being that he would need someone to help him turn on the computer first.

Who knows what would have happened if Redknapp had stayed on?

Who knows what would have happened had he finished 6th or 7th the year before - would he have gone already?

Who knows what would have happened had he not already accepted the England job before it had even been offered to him, whilst being trialed for tax evasion, and then only winning 4 of the last 13 games of the season?

Who knows? - not me and certainly not you.

Myself, who lives in the present rather than continually spilling tears for a decision that was made (rightly or wrongly, that is for another thread or six) 3 years ago, I can only consider our current predicament and the topic in question.

And for me; 12-18 months is not long enough to make an informed decision on our current manager.

 

[JDK]

Can't believe people still think sacking the manager will provide some sort of fix. It's the players and the ownership that has selected the players that need the overhaul.

The only time we've improved from sacking a manager is Ramos. Redknapp was given time and as good of backing as Levy is capable of and he gave us our best teams since Venables. His time did coincide with generational players like Modric and Bale and he did have his faults but he did a good job and was allowed to build his team. Redknapp succeeded by using veteran players he could rely on and placing skilled players in an uncomplicated position to thrive. Levy hasn't allowed our other managers to instill their vision and philosophy and we've failed. The lesson of our successful period under Redknapp should be that the manager should be allowed to craft the team he wants to coach. There's no sense in just throwing players to a manager when they don't fit into his vision or style of play.

 

[Eskimo]

Amazing, you can't argue with logic like that! It always comes back to Redknapp!

If only the man in question could see how much time was spent on here agonising over his dismissal, his ego would sky rocket. The irony being that he would need someone to help him turn on the computer first.

Who knows what would have happened if Redknapp had stayed on?

Who knows what would have happened had he finished 6th or 7th the year before - would he have gone already?

Who knows what would have happened had he not already accepted the England job before it had even been offered to him, whilst being trialed for tax evasion, and then only winning 4 of the last 13 games of the season.

Who knows - not me and certainly not you.

Myself, who lives in the present rather than continually spilling tears for a decision that was made (rightly or wrongly, that is for another thread or six) 3 years ago, I can only consider our current predicament and the topic in question.



And for me; 12-18 months is not long enough to make an informed decision on our current manager.

Who knows what would happen if we sacked Pochettino and brought in a replacement? no one, but sticking with a manager purely because "we haven't stuck with a manager" is a pretty shit reason to stick with a manager. Which was my original point.

 

[Dixiefish61]

Who knows what would happen if we sacked Pochettino and brought in a replacement? no one, but sticking with a manager purely because "we haven't stuck with a manager" is a pretty shit reason to stick with a manager. Which was my original point.

It's not a shit reason if we have only had the manager one season. We've tried 'cut 'em loose'. It didn't work. This time next season? Who knows but one season isn't long enough. Plus, who realistically is available as a viable alternative who can come in, hit the ground running and get this lot performing?

 

[JDK]

Who knows what would happen if we sacked Pochettino and brought in a replacement? no one, but sticking with a manager purely because "we haven't stuck with a manager" is a pretty shit reason to stick with a manager. Which was my original point.

While the season has been inconsistent it isn't like we are the relegation zone. We convincingly beat the league champions, took four points off Woolwich, and went to a cup final, could still finish fifth, and development of young players has been good. It isn't like faith in Pochettino is based on pure blind optimism. Though there's been shit and inexcusable aspects, there are plenty of positives to assess to Pochettino besides just sticking with him for continuity sake.

 

[LLB Part Deux]

Jol: 3 years
Redknapp 3 1/2 years
AVB: 1 1/2 years

The best we did in that period is when we kept the manager for the longer periods no?

Well, two things at work there. First is that doing well tends to = being given longer to be manager. The second thing is that arguably Jol, Harry and AVB did better in the first 50% of their games at Spurs than the second 50%...

Saying that longer = better is dismissive of the base fact that doing better tends to give you more time in the job. Over the last umpteen years in the Prem I'm struggling to think of too many sides that have clearly benefited from sticking with a manger when they weren't performing - everyone can roll out Fergie, but he was more an exception than the rule. Maybe Moyes? This season Pearson you could look at, but Leicester were actually playing well and not getting the results.

 

[mouse]

Whats the alternative then? Another big pay off, another massive transition in back room and coaching staff? A squad full of players that were identified by 4 or 5 different managers each with their own philosophy and identity? Small cliques of players, each with their own agendas. Does that reflect cohesion and stability to you? Is that the root to getting the consistency that we need to compete at the level we aspire to.

Our club becomes even more of a joke in the eyes of the press and our rivals because we yet again prove that our fans don't have what it takes to stick through the rough patch.

I've already told you that i don't know whether Poch will work out, but I've seen enough to give me an indication thats its worth the risk, and its better than the alternative which has been played out numerous times to the same conclusion.

 

[Eskimo]

While the season has been inconsistent it isn't like we are the relegation zone. We convincingly beat the league champions, took four points off Woolwich, and went to a cup final, could still finish fifth, and development of young players has been good. It isn't like faith in Pochettino is based on pure blind optimism. Though there's been shit and inexcusable aspects, there are plenty of positives to assess to Pochettino besides just sticking with him for continuity sake.

Yes we beat woolwich and chelsea, but where was a similar level of performance to that against other sides?
We've lost to some shit sides this year and not because of the old reason of the other keeper having the game of his life but because we've been garbage.

 

[mouse]

Yes we beat woolwich and chelsea, but where was a similar level of performance to that against other sides?
We've lost to some shit sides this year and not because of the old reason of the other keeper having the game of his life but because we've been garbage.

You think that replacing the manager for the 4th time in 4 years will help us to be more consistent?

 

[JDK]

Yes we beat woolwich and chelsea, but where was a similar level of performance to that against other sides?
We've lost to some shit sides this year and not because of the old reason of the other keeper having the game of his life but because we've been garbage.

Losing to shit sides due to being shit isn't something new. Even with an accomplished manager like Redknapp we still had awful results and performances against Stoke, QPR, Norwich and Villa in his final season. That's talking just about Redknapps last season not even addressing AVB and Tim. Acting like this is the first season of having bad performances is disingenuous.

Getting results against good teams with a team that you have barely been allowed to mould at all for me indicates likelihood of improvement. Especially when you consider our dismal record against top teams last season. That has improved vastly this season. It would stand to reason that with investment, another year of experience for a young squad, and further integration of coaching that Pochettino will be able to mitigate our crap performances based on his ability to garner results and performances against top sides.

 

[LLB Part Deux]

Redknapp was given time and as good of backing as Levy is capable of and he gave us our best teams since Venables.

Redknapp came in and delivered instant improvement in our team, going from err... *cough* some points in some games *cough* to 5th place in his first season. He wasn't given time, he earned it.

*disclaimer* as ever, I'd only advocate getting rid of Poch at any time - now, Xmas or whenever - if there were better options available and willing *disclaimer*

 

[JDK]

Redknapp came in and delivered instant improvement in our team, going from err... *cough* some points in some games *cough* to 5th place in his first season. He wasn't given time, he earned it.

*disclaimer* as ever, I'd only advocate getting rid of Poch at any time - now, Xmas or whenever - if there were better options available and willing *disclaimer*

While you're right to say Redknapp did provide instant improvement, the only place to go was up. Also, we finished 8th that season not 5th.

Pochettino has given us instant improvement in playing top 4 teams which we got 1 point off last season including some absolute drubbings.

 

[SchmoodSpur2013]

Which pretty much backs up what I'm saying:

Since 2004 (roughly):

Santini: 4 months
Jol: 3 years
Ramos: 1 year
Redknapp 3 1/2 years
AVB: 1 1/2 years
Sherwood: 6 months
Poch: 1 year.

The best we did in that period is when we kept the manager for the longer periods no? 7 managers in 10 years is not really ideal.

I've said plenty of times Poch needs to improve but I think we need more consistency and 1 year isn't enough for a manager to turn around the mess that AVB/Sherwood left behind.

3 years ago today Robben missed his penalty and Bayern then went on to lose on penalies against a chelsea team that were in the final thanks to lionel messi missing a penalty, this culminated in us missing out on champions league qualification, a large percentage of our fans and indeed our chairman were adamant we could do better under a different manager. Look at us now.

Take a bow

Yea, take a bow for completely ignoring YidoBuckler 's post which provided a very sensible and convincing view of the one opposite yours.

Just close your eyes and move swiftly on to something which edges you nearer to your favourite topic and the crux of all your posts, Harry Redknapp.

 

[Eskimo]

Pochettino has given us instant improvement in playing top 4 teams which we got 1 point off last season including some absolute drubbings.

If we are going to finish with less points than last year that would indicate we have gone backwards against sides outside of the top 4?

 

[Eskimo]

You think that replacing the manager for the 4th time in 4 years will help us to be more consistent?

Did you think replacing the manager a 3rd time would help us be more consistent?

Also surely changing your manager 4 times in 4 years is the epitome of consistent? ochlol: