New Manager?

[Lister]

You say that, but LvG is still dropping hints about "other clubs" in his interviews and just a few weeks ago FdB seemed up for the job. Doesn't strike me as having been going on for months at all. Seems to me like he's been speaking to lots of people but is going for the easy option.
And, like I say, the guy has zero experience of CL management. He's just managerial flavour of the month. It's a huge gamble to expect him to get us to the level Levy wants. Footballing styles aside, this, for me, carries as much risk as both AVB and Weasel. I really wanted us to get for a name who had won some trophies and managed in the CL. To pull one out of the bag. In fact, the more I think about it the more I think I'd prefer fat Spanish waiter for those reasons. I'm not big fan of his - but at least he's familiar with what it takes to get into and play the CL.

I would venture he has been making contact, having conversations and compiling a very short list of top candidates which he is now getting into the nitty gritty with.

FDB is clearly as available as Piochetino (both 1 year on contract iirc, at smaller clubs where severance wont be an issue). LVG, Tuchel, Prandelli, Spalletti all out of work (or will be this summer).
Availability is not the driving factor here, IMHO.

I like his style of play, I think it ties in with what I would like at the club and would suit our squad. Attacking, positive football with a thoughtful, tactical foundation. Pretty much bang on, IMO.

I like that clearly his Southampton players are very motivated to perform, every game. Its a plus to him that AVB lacked. As is his pragmatism in how he sets up (eg quite happy to make use of a long ball) and while he strongly believes in a full team pressing game he isnt devoted to a high line with it.

And, above all the other candidates, he is experienced in the premiship. What its all about. There isnt the risk of him coming in with his own set ways that work in slower/weaker divisions and getting caught out.

Yes, no CL experience. Like Redknapp then. For me, if he got us to the CL Id be quite happy to see how he did in the CL. And I suspect his style of play is suited to european football pretty well.

 

[Oh FFS]

I can't see LVG using Spurs as anything other then leverage to get himself a better contract at United. Unless a prospective manager has a particular affinity to Spurs, why would he choose us over United.

LVG - as long as he is the man United want, is a no goer.

Best to move for FDB early before the post world cup manager merry-go-round begins.

 

[Tomo]

Just not viable though, is it?

Whoever we get is a gamble because we simply cant shop at the top table.

Pochettino? Relatively little experience/gravitas.
FDB? Never dealt with the premier league.
LVG? (Out of reach really) Old and curmugdeonly and with a list of failures as well as successes.
Prandelli/Spaletti? Never managed in the premiership

Bottom line is, like players, we have to gamble on those we think will make the step up. IMO all of these candidates have merit, so if we pick one they get a clean slate and best wishes from me while they set about doing what they can do.

Good point. Its almost as if Levy's 'your fired' culture has infected even us fans, we now demands as right the perfect manager, someone with CL experience, Prem experience, success, posiitive football, good player management, good media skills and the ability to bow down to the all powerful ego of Levy. For me attacking football and a bit of success should be enough to put a manager in contention. We are not Real Madrid, we cannot demand the best as our right.

We should be lucky if we get FDB or Pochenttino after the way our last three managers have been treated and Levy has to learn to eat some humble pie otherwise we will never grow into anything. We get Frank De Boer, I would take a £50 million buy out clause and Levy can do his laundry and beg him every season to stay with the club, time we get real about where we are.

 

[Smoked Salmon]

I would venture he has been making contact, having conversations and compiling a very short list of top candidates which he is now getting into the nitty gritty with.

FDB is clearly as available as Piochetino (both 1 year on contract iirc, at smaller clubs where severance wont be an issue). LVG, Tuchel, Prandelli, Spalletti all out of work (or will be this summer).
Availability is not the driving factor here, IMHO.

I like his style of play, I think it ties in with what I would like at the club and would suit our squad. Attacking, positive football with a thoughtful, tactical foundation. Pretty much bang on, IMO.

I like that clearly his Southampton players are very motivated to perform, every game. Its a plus to him that AVB lacked. As is his pragmatism in how he sets up (eg quite happy to make use of a long ball) and while he strongly believes in a full team pressing game he isnt devoted to a high line with it.

And, above all the other candidates, he is experienced in the premiship. What its all about. There isnt the risk of him coming in with his own set ways that work in slower/weaker divisions and getting caught out.

Yes, no CL experience. Like Redknapp then. For me, if he got us to the CL Id be quite happy to see how he did in the CL. And I suspect his style of play is suited to european football pretty well.

Hope you're right. I'm just a bit worried he's been flattered by some of the talent he's had at Southampton. I'm also thinking, as was suggested above, that maybe FdB for one might inspire the players more.

If rumours are to be believed our top players gave an ultimatum that if Sherwood stayed they would look to leave. With that in mind, the bigger the name, the bigger the placation. With Poch I am concerned that some of our senior players will look at him and have the same reservations on risk that I have.

 

[Lister]

Good point. Its almost as if Levy's 'your fired' culture has infected even us fans...

I think Levy is all about offering opportunity and expecting reward.

Look at the moves he has made with managers and almost all are people he gave a chance too - and almost all went when they appeared to have no more to offer. Is it that bad?

Redknapp was a total punt, it seemed. And yet I recal as clear as day Levy saying how he had wanted Redknapp for a while but it never came together before then (I remember because its about the only time he ever did an on-camera interview for them!).

He gave Redknapp a MASSIVE opportunity, at a level he had never managed before and likely never will again. And if anything, Redknapp was proven as a jobbing manager of bottom half sides. Yet look how he did. He took the opportunity, the extra resource/quality he had to work with took his methods up several levels and he brought us top 4 twice and a super CL run.

Jol, we loved, another punt. Sherwood - the ultimate punt and Im sure had he REALLY impressed he would be in the job now.

His two biggest failures are when he has gone for names. Santini the France manager and Ramos the european darling.

If he offers an opportunity to someone like Pochettino, who on the face of it has a lot of positives, then Im happy to watch on with interest. I wont be writing it off straight away.

 

[mouse]

Whoever gets the job can't be any worse than this lot... Can they?

http://www.theguardian.com/football...niel-levy-gallery#/?picture=436789801&index=0

 

[Lister]

Hope you're right. I'm just a bit worried he's been flattered by some of the talent he's had at Southampton. I'm also thinking, as was suggested above, that maybe FdB for one might inspire the players more.

I think its undeniable Adkins was doing a bloody good job there with those players, and yet Pochettino immediately improved them. Seems a little unfair to say its simply that he has been fortunate to have good players.

Undoubtedly its a bonus for him. Though Id suggest he has better players (in the main) to work with here. So why couldnt he work well with them also?

It is also down to him that young players come into a stable set up, knowing how to play and are succeeding in the premiership (excelling, even). Yes they have to have the quality, but how often have we seen young players handled clumsily by hamfisted managers and their prospects ruined?

Im not Pochettinos biggest advocate (though Im aware I might sound like it just now!) but I do like a lot of what I see in him. Id be happy if he came in.

What I like?

• Style of play
• Attention to detail
• Motivation of players
• Promotion of youth
• Premiership experience
• Having a club punch above its weight (not sure its all down to him, but he certainly plays a part)

What am I not sure about?

• Can he deal with a larger squad/rotation?
• Can he juggle multiple competitions?
• Will he need to speak English to the media? Will using a translator be an issue?
• Some buys at SCBC have been a bit ropey - how much input did he have? (Or would he expect?)
• How does he operate under genuine pressure? The scrutiny at Spurs will be 10x that at SCBC, and at SCBC he has had nothing really at stake. With us its a whole different situation.

Plenty of pros and cons, but on balance Id be very interested in seeing how he did with us.

If rumours are to be believed our top players gave an ultimatum that if Sherwood stayed they would look to leave. With that in mind, the bigger the name, the bigger the placation. With Poch I am concerned that some of our senior players will look at him and have the same reservations on risk that I have.

Quite honestly Ive paid no attention to that rumour at all. Its most likely complete bollocks. And on the off chance its not, what is their complaint? "Tim isnt a big enough name"? Or "Tim hasnt a clue what he is doing"?

I think its more likely the latter, and on that basis as soon as someone (anyone) comes in and shows they know their stuff there is no longer an issue.

 

[Nick "Trevor" Sharp]

If this is true...I'm going to have to learn how to spell his name.

Hey, if we can manage Pavlyuchenko...

 

[Fryer]

Frank De Boer not ambitious enough? Are you kidding me? Four Eredivisie titles at Ajax. Playing experience at Ajax and Barcelona.

He's shit hot mate, he'll be a top manager in world football one day

Hmm, don't get me wrong, impressive though the 4 titles are (ignoring any argument that says Eredivise is a second class league) he's hardly the vastly experienced manager that every other top4/5 club has already. All the other top 4 managers have vast experience and several top clubs winning international cups and leagues and the rest of it. Granted, FdB may become one of these, in that sense we have to strike it lucky, hope we are hiring the next Mourhino or Wenger, but the reality is the top clubs can just go and pluck a ready made version of this (as with utd). I don't think any of our current targets can make us surpass these clubs in the next 3 seasons unless we do a sheikh spending spree (again). Thats Spursy, we probably dont merit one a manager like that, so we are left choosing the dark horse like FdB who we hope will exceed our expectations, but in that case Levy and the fans need to stop dreaming of top 4 for the time being and be prepared to whether the storm for the foreseeable future.

 

[Tomo]

I think Levy is all about offering opportunity and expecting reward.

Look at the moves he has made with managers and almost all are people he gave a chance too - and almost all went when they appeared to have no more to offer. Is it that bad?
.

I don't really agree with the no more to offer unless there is real evidence that there is no more to offer. Wenger, Fergie, Mourinho don't always win things but its not through lack of trying, constantly changing the guard because you feel that there is some magic man who can 'take us to another level' is how we went from Redknapp to AVB. Managers or at least good managers need time to build a style and culture within a club and weed out the bad players (not good enough or to big an ego) and improve. I understand if the manager has been total crap and nothing looks like improving but we have created a really bad reputation in the Prem for treating managers.

I hope our next manager is so fucking good we can't sack him and if Levy tries to a mob goes around his houses with pitch forks.

 

[Lister]

I don't really agree with the no more to offer unless there is real evidence that there is no more to offer. Wenger, Fergie, Mourinho don't always win things but its not through lack of trying, constantly changing the guard because you feel that there is some magic man who can 'take us to another level' is how we went from Redknapp to AVB. Managers or at least good managers need time to build a style and culture within a club and weed out the bad players (not good enough or to big an ego) and improve. I understand if the manager has been total crap and nothing looks like improving but we have created a really bad reputation in the Prem for treating managers.

I hope our next manager is so fucking good we can't sack him and if Levy tries to a mob goes around his houses with pitch forks.

It obviously comes down to perception, and opinion.
IMHO Redknapp had gone as far as he could - not as far as we could. Of course plenty disagree.
Much the same with Jol, he peaked before we did, IMO. But, as I see it, I dont think its unfair to say they went when it looked like they little more to offer.

Of course, I highly advocate giving a manager time. However, only so long as it looks like he can produce more and its more a blip than a trend.

I think its a shame we have managed to build this poor reputation. Its deserved, we have had 10 in 13 years (or whatever it is) but Im still not convinced its as bad as some say. I long for getting someone in who can have a run of 5 years or more.

And I absolutely agree, hopefully the new guy will be so damn good he will be unsackable.

 

[Tomo]

It obviously comes down to perception, and opinion.
IMHO Redknapp had gone as far as he could - not as far as we could. Of course plenty disagree.
Much the same with Jol, he peaked before we did, IMO. But, as I see it, I dont think its unfair to say they went when it looked like they little more to offer.

Of course, I highly advocate giving a manager time. However, only so long as it looks like he can produce more and its more a blip than a trend.

I think its a shame we have managed to build this poor reputation. Its deserved, we have had 10 in 13 years (or whatever it is) but Im still not convinced its as bad as some say. I long for getting someone in who can have a run of 5 years or more.

And I absolutely agree, hopefully the new guy will be so damn good he will be unsackable.

I just look at Newcastle and worry that is where we could end up if we are not careful. They have a butt average team and Pardew got them middle table which is probably above the players they have, so he made the players achieve at or close to their potential but the geordie fans want him out and replaced by a voodoo casting wizard who will transform their players into Ronaldo somehow.

Redknapp love him or hate him made our players play at or close to their potential, AVB and Tim did not and that really is all a manager can do is make the sqaud of players we have play as good as their talents allow. For us to go further may require addidition investment in world class players. I believe we have a good sqaud (left back aside) potential might be 4th and the right manager can perhaps in a few years make a top 4 challenge, just want to give the guy a lot of time.

 

[AjaxSpursFTW]

Love it how you guys all consider ajax a smaller club. What have Spurs won? Ajax got 4 CL cups, 32 titles, europa cup 2, uefa cup, 2 worldcups. Everybody acknowledges their historic influence on the game. Raised player like cruijff, van basten, sneijder, kluivert (too lazy to type them all) Spurs latest starlets have Ajax written all over them and they are far from having any historic impact on ajax (eriksen, verthongen, vdv).. Played CL 4y in a row..

Yet ajax is the smaller team

And the fucked up thing is that you are fucking right too

 

[Lister]

Yet ajax is the smaller team

And the fucked up thing is that you are fucking right too

In the context I put it I simply meant financially, not historically.
We are much bigger so far as riches go and so can bully around smaller clubs and take their property.
Just as bigger clubs do to us.

I certainly meant no offence.

 

[Oh FFS]

Love it how you guys all consider ajax a smaller club. What have Spurs won? Ajax got 4 CL cups, 32 titles, europa cup 2, uefa cup, 2 worldcups. Everybody acknowledges their historic influence on the game. Raised player like cruijff, van basten, sneijder, kluivert (too lazy to type them all) Spurs latest starlets have Ajax written all over them and they are far from having any historic impact on ajax (eriksen, verthongen, vdv).. Played CL 4y in a row..

Yet ajax is the smaller team

And the fucked up thing is that you are fucking right too

Ajax is a great example of how the modern game has changed the world of football. I remember when Ajax were still a European Giant, but the game is all about money now, and the Dutch League just doesn't have it.,

As an Ajax fan, do you think FBD is a good fit for Spurs, and Spurs a good fit for FDB?

 

[Lister]

I just look at Newcastle and worry that is where we could end up if we are not careful. They have a butt average team and Pardew got them middle table which is probably above the players they have, so he made the players achieve at or close to their potential but the geordie fans want him out and replaced by a voodoo casting wizard who will transform their players into Ronaldo somehow.

Redknapp love him or hate him made our players play at or close to their potential, AVB and Tim did not and that really is all a manager can do is make the sqaud of players we have play as good as their talents allow. For us to go further may require addidition investment in world class players. I believe we have a good sqaud (left back aside) potential might be 4th and the right manager can perhaps in a few years make a top 4 challenge, just want to give the guy a lot of time.

Part of why they are where they are is because of putting jokers like Kinnear in positions of power, they get what they deserve.

Ive always firmly believed that a manager can elevate his team above the sum of its parts. Given the position we are in it will take that to really get us in the mix.
I also believe to achieve this a system of play needs to be employed that all understand and buy into - knowing what to do and when is key.
Take that, and add some genuine quality (which we have) and IMHO the sky is the limit.

I dont think Sherwood, AVB, Redknapp, Ramos or Jol achieved this.

And yet, on a different scale, the likes of Allardyce and Pulis do it regularly. I hate the style of play - but that isnt the point - the point is that "A system" allows them to really flourish.

 

[sammyspurs]

Have you considered that maybe nobody gives a shit about whether or not you've won your latest argument?

You clearly stopped giving a shit when I posted a quote that showed you to be a, ow you zay, blatant liar.....the irony

 

[Fryer]

I dont think Sherwood, AVB, Redknapp, Ramos or Jol achieved this.

And yet, on a different scale, the likes of Allardyce and Pulis do it regularly. I hate the style of play - but that isnt the point - the point is that "A system" allows them to really flourish.

I'd argue Harry did, when you look at the position we started in, but only just (and at least relative to who was in the top four). Not that its the point anyway.

Speaking of Pullis......to much boring football or worth a 5 month contract?

 

[Park Lane James]

Hmm, don't get me wrong, impressive though the 4 titles are (ignoring any argument that says Eredivise is a second class league) he's hardly the vastly experienced manager that every other top4/5 club has already. All the other top 4 managers have vast experience and several top clubs winning international cups and leagues and the rest of it. Granted, FdB may become one of these, in that sense we have to strike it lucky, hope we are hiring the next Mourhino or Wenger, but the reality is the top clubs can just go and pluck a ready made version of this (as with utd). I don't think any of our current targets can make us surpass these clubs in the next 3 seasons unless we do a sheikh spending spree (again). Thats Spursy, we probably dont merit one a manager like that, so we are left choosing the dark horse like FdB who we hope will exceed our expectations, but in that case Levy and the fans need to stop dreaming of top 4 for the time being and be prepared to whether the storm for the foreseeable future.

This is Tottenham Hotspur mate, not Manchester United. Most of the names we have been linked with aren't the sort of managers who have won 'international cups, leagues and the rest of it', strictly because we cannot attract those sorts of names. This job is a poisoned chalice, and I don't think many top managers will give it the time of day because they know at the slightest hint of trouble they'll be out of here. The only top, top manager we have been linked with has used us as a pawn to get the United job before the World Cup.

Frank de Boer is by no means a 'dark horse', he's on the road to managerial stardom just like Ancelotti was a couple of decades ago after he finished his career as a player.

If a manager is good enough, it doesn't matter so much if they have limited managerial experience - Pep Guardiola has proved that (but of course it is the 'safer' option). De Boer has trodden a similar path in that he started off working with the Acadmey at Ajax before taking the top job. He'll be in a 'top' managerial job within five years IMO (Barca, Man United, Juventus etc)

 

[Lister]

I'd argue Harry did, when you look at the position we started in, but only just (and at least relative to who was in the top four). Not that its the point anyway.

Speaking of Pullis......to much boring football or worth a 5 month contract?

I think Harry got us playing to about the level "of the sum of our parts" but never exceeded it. As I said though, its all opinion - Im sure some agree and plenty dont.

Pulis has been superb for Palace, absolutely brilliant. Would never work for us though, IMO. Managers and clubs have to be compatible, and there are plenty that just arent.

Look at Moyes/Utd this season. (Mel/WBA, Meulenstein/Fulham)