Davinson Sanchez

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Spurs_in_Pune said:
Is sacrificing playstyle in favour of results for some matches given we have injuries, a gain or simply maintaining momentum?

Look Iam not asking our manager to, let's say sit back against City, when we have all our first choice players fit in greed of a point or a win on the back of a counter But since the squad isn't yet fashioned to Ange's liking, it should be obvious that the playstyle will have to give in case of injuries in the squad.
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Not necessarily if you have a player than can allow you to maintain your plan A (i.e. Dier v Dav)

Besides, I was replying to your ref to the early EPL days of Pep & Klopp. You brought them up afterall......... They weren't scenarios predicated by injury; they were as you just described: "the squad [wasn't] yet fashioned to [their] liking".
 
Shadydan said:
Klopp and Pep are clowns who have both won PL's and CL's yet here you are claiming they did the wrong thing in implementing their philosophy early doors, okay then , not really sure what to say about that. 🤦‍♀️
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Did Klopp win the PL's and the CL's with Nathaniel Clyne? Did Pep, do so with Zabaleta and Hart? They didn't. Their teams would also get punished for that(Liverpool more than City).

Shadydan said:
Sanchez won't start as he is gone now but everyone with a pair of eyes will tell you that he's a much better option in Ange's system over Dier who is just utterley useless, Sanchez had one thing that Dier lacked severely and that was pace.
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Made mistakes against Barca and Fulham that directly led to goals/chances. He's not a good defender. If Pace is all that's required, let's buy Dan James from Leeds and play him at the back. I would rather have Dier who atleast can be ok in a makeshift setup than an unpredictable Sanchez
 
Spurs_in_Pune said:
Did Klopp win the PL's and the CL's with Nathaniel Clyne? Did Pep, do so with Zabaleta and Hart? They didn't. Their teams would also get punished for that(Liverpool more than City).


Made mistakes against Barca and Fulham that directly led to goals/chances. He's not a good defender. If Pace is all that's required, let's buy Dan James from Leeds and play him at the back. I would rather have Dier who atleast can be ok in a makeshift setup than an unpredictable Sanchez
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No they both installed their philosophy early on so that the players learned the system, it ensured that the players who didn't fit were rooted out from the club and it ensured their respective boards of the vision they were implementing of the kind of players who were needed to bring into the club, that is how stamp your blueprint on a club which eventually leads to success.

Cause -> Effect.

You can point me to all the mistakes all you want and I can do that likewise for Dier but that's not the point and it tells me you're too heavily focused on the wrong thing, it's about fit - Dier just doesn't fit in a high line, doesn't fit in a low block (as seen last season) you said yourself that you want the manager to accommodate him to hide his deficiencies which says it all, that's actually mental - trying our level best trying to accommodate shit players is to the total detriment to the team, we're trying to move forwards not go backwards.

I'd rather see a youngster in the team over Dier by the way and by the sounds of it so would Ange, might lead to some growing pains in the short term but long term we will reap the benefits.
 
Airfixx said:
Not necessarily if you have a player than can allow you to maintain your plan A (i.e. Dier v Dav)

Besides, I was replying to your ref to the early EPL days of Pep & Klopp. You brought them up afterall......... They weren't scenarios predicated by injury; they were as you just described: "the squad [wasn't] yet fashioned to [their] liking".
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But Dav is not the option. He is a poor defender who has made shocking mistakes from Mourinho to Ange. Dier is a poor defender but can be decent, if for a few matches, we could accomodate him. Iam not asking Ange to give up on his playstyle
 
Shadydan said:
You can point me to all the mistakes all you want and I can do that likewise for Dier but that's not the point and it tells me you're too heavily focused on the wrong thing, it's about fit - Dier just doesn't fit in a high line, doesn't fit in a low block (as seen last season) you said yourself that you want the manager to accommodate him to hide his deficiencies which says it all, that's actually mental - trying our level best trying to accommodate shit players is to the total detriment to the team, we're trying to move forwards not go backwards.
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Sanchez's has been worse than dier's. And the question isn't if either of them is a good defender. The question is who is a better defender. And you can't just ignore Dier's previous season with Conte and declare he doesn't fit in a low block.
A couple of matches here and there won't decide the overall progress and neither would tactical changes for the sake of the team undermine Ange's vision. If we were to go down to Dier or Sanchez(our only 2 senior defenders before Sanchez was off to Galata because Levy couldn't agree on a cober), we would already be in deep trouble. Then it's about making the best of a bad situation

Shadydan said:
I'd rather see a youngster in the team over Dier by the way and by the sounds of it so would Ange, might lead to some growing pains in the short term but long term we will reap the benefits.
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If Ange deems them ready, fine by me. But if the choice is Dier or Sanchez, it's always Dier for me.
 
Spurs_in_Pune said:
Sanchez's has been worse than dier's. And the question isn't if either of them is a good defender. The question is who is a better defender. And you can't just ignore Dier's previous season with Conte and declare he doesn't fit in a low block.
A couple of matches here and there won't decide the overall progress and neither would tactical changes for the sake of the team undermine Ange's vision. If we were to go down to Dier or Sanchez(our only 2 senior defenders before Sanchez was off to Galata because Levy couldn't agree on a cober), we would already be in deep trouble. Then it's about making the best of a bad situation


If Ange deems them ready, fine by me. But if the choice is Dier or Sanchez, it's always Dier for me.
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Sanchez is/was a better fit for Ange's system over Dier. Ange's system takes presidency over anything, I don't think he has ever played a low block and he even said that he would never alter his principles, so not only is this moot as Sanchez has gone, even if he were still here Dier wouldn't see a minute of pitch time over him.

Citing Dier's one good year out of how many bad ones only means that he was treading above water and last season he went back to his natural level.
 
Spurs_in_Pune said:
But Dav is not the option. He is a poor defender who has made shocking mistakes from Mourinho to Ange. Dier is a poor defender but can be decent, if for a few matches, we could accomodate him. Iam not asking Ange to give up on his playstyle
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Season 4 Michael GIF by The Office


You are absolutely asking Ange to give up his "play style" by selecting Dier over Sanchez.

You said so yourself...

So don't play a high line then?

Shouldn't Ange adapt for a short period of time?

It's all moot now anyway but if you think that Dier solves a problem in Ange's system that Sanchez would not have been a better solution for then I can only query your understanding of the game,
 
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Airfixx said:
Me neither..... Dier massively failed his audition v Barca.

Dav may have had his flaws, but fundamentally he was way better suited to how Ange wants to play........ It's baffling that some people don't see this..... (And I say that as someone that has seen fit to defend Dier on many many occasions.)
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I think some people have a perception of Dier as being similar to Davies, a bit of a steady eddie. Whereas Sanchez committed errors that wouldn't be out of place in a looney toons sketch.

In reality, outside of half a season under Conte, his career as a CB has been embarassing. He has had plenty of howlers, unforced errors, and just getting ripped to shreds by opposition forwards.
 
I can't remember seeing a defender slip and fall over so much. In all seriousness he should probably get checked out for some balance issues or whatever it's called.
 
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