With Spurs straight through to the group stages of the 2015/16 Europa League, Jay Tennant looks at whether it is worth taking serious this time?
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Good read. 
surely it's ALWAYS worth taking a European competition seriously... it's not like we're extolling the virtues of the Intertoto or Anglo/Italian Cup... it's the UEFA CUP FFS!
I think people have become too blasé and unrealistic about what trophies we are actually in with a shout of.
the Premier League (and obviously CL) are light years away... the FA Cup is probably just gonna stay at the Emirates now 'cos apparently the rest of football can't be fucking bothered to challenge them for it...
so that leaves us with 'just' The League Cup and the Europa League... either of which I'd be happy with and BOTH of which we're more than capable of winning!
I think people have become too blasé and unrealistic about what trophies we are actually in with a shout of.
the Premier League (and obviously CL) are light years away... the FA Cup is probably just gonna stay at the Emirates now 'cos apparently the rest of football can't be fucking bothered to challenge them for it...
so that leaves us with 'just' The League Cup and the Europa League... either of which I'd be happy with and BOTH of which we're more than capable of winning!
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Absolutely worth it. Our haul of 3 European trophies puts us as the joint 12th most successful club in European competition, a 4th trophy would put us in the top 10.
Woolwich are joint 27th on that list...
Woolwich are joint 27th on that list...
Great article.
I cant even understand why we would even debate the worthiness of the EL,. We have had this type of discussion on here a million times before, take the EL seriously and challenge for glory. For club, fans and players its a golden opportunity to gain some respect, add silverwear to the cabinet and go to games that actually mean something (well if you skip the first two rounds that is). As a young un the European nights were games you stayed up for.
The arrogance of some people claiming its beneath us, yeah because we've won it so many times in the last few years that its obviously beneath us.
Seeing spurs win the EL would be a dream come true.
I cant even understand why we would even debate the worthiness of the EL,. We have had this type of discussion on here a million times before, take the EL seriously and challenge for glory. For club, fans and players its a golden opportunity to gain some respect, add silverwear to the cabinet and go to games that actually mean something (well if you skip the first two rounds that is). As a young un the European nights were games you stayed up for.
The arrogance of some people claiming its beneath us, yeah because we've won it so many times in the last few years that its obviously beneath us.
Seeing spurs win the EL would be a dream come true.
Methinks some of the denial of the worth of the EL comes from the genuine fear that we simply haven't been good enough to win it. In each of the years we've gone out in the knockout phases it hasn't been because we haven't 'given it a go' - it's been because we've been outplayed (Benfica in 2014, Basel in 2013).
Thats quite depressing, even if we take it serious we would still lack the grit and determination to go and win it.
We have to decide what taking it seriously means - is it playing our best team for league and cups, maybe rotating the odd player. Or is it having our best team play in the cup and then rest players for the league. There will have to be rotation of some kind, and the manager has to make sure th eplayers coming in are sharp and ready - eg not out of the squad for a couple of months.
I think the team we put out this season in most EL games was good enough, but were never really match fit.
I think the team we put out this season in most EL games was good enough, but were never really match fit.
Belgian Spur
Something relevant to you I suppose. Since I was about 12, having drawn them when randomising drunken Fifa matches, I've always had a soft spot for and loosely followed Charleroi.Needless to say, I was absolutely delighted when they qualified for Europa the other day! :bentalebscream:
....or here's a thought. How about we look at it Glass half full from now on... hear me out.
Second only to the distance the team spend travelling, Sunday games seem to irritate a lot of people. But look at it this way... it prolongs the weekend feast of football! We get to sit back and enjoy everyone else slogging it out on a Saturday (don't tell me you don't enjoy watching other teams' scores come in, with no pressure or worrying that ours will be one of them!)
Then on the Sunday, we have a whole matchday to look forward to, with all of the build up focussed usually on only 2 or 3 games... OBVIOUSLY if we lose, the weekend's ruined, but there's much LESS of that weekend ruined, and at least you get your Saturday nights to enjoy yourselves/warm-up for Sunday!
I quite like Sunday matches me'self!
Still can't beat the 'tradition' of a 3pm Saturday k.o... but they seem fewer and far between now... so lets enjoy the novelty of them when they do come along!!
Second only to the distance the team spend travelling, Sunday games seem to irritate a lot of people. But look at it this way... it prolongs the weekend feast of football! We get to sit back and enjoy everyone else slogging it out on a Saturday (don't tell me you don't enjoy watching other teams' scores come in, with no pressure or worrying that ours will be one of them!)
Then on the Sunday, we have a whole matchday to look forward to, with all of the build up focussed usually on only 2 or 3 games... OBVIOUSLY if we lose, the weekend's ruined, but there's much LESS of that weekend ruined, and at least you get your Saturday nights to enjoy yourselves/warm-up for Sunday!
I quite like Sunday matches me'self!
Still can't beat the 'tradition' of a 3pm Saturday k.o... but they seem fewer and far between now... so lets enjoy the novelty of them when they do come along!!
Question for the author- what would you actually do differently to take it more seriously?
I love European nights for their atmosphere, the status and the fact it's more Spurs matches- so I agree with the sentiment, and want to win the EL. But what I don't quite 'get' about the argument this article is making is the "giving it a go".
As someone's mentioned above, we've recently been knocked out by decent European opposition at a similar level to us (Benfica, Fiorentina), with us playing most if not all our first choice players. I'd understand the argument if we were routinely knocked out in the Group, playing lots of youth players- like in 2011/12, but that's not the case.
What is the author actually suggesting we do differently in relation to the Europa League? The only thing I can think of, realistically, is resting the best players for the league games before EL knock out ties, which is unlikely.
I love European nights for their atmosphere, the status and the fact it's more Spurs matches- so I agree with the sentiment, and want to win the EL. But what I don't quite 'get' about the argument this article is making is the "giving it a go".
As someone's mentioned above, we've recently been knocked out by decent European opposition at a similar level to us (Benfica, Fiorentina), with us playing most if not all our first choice players. I'd understand the argument if we were routinely knocked out in the Group, playing lots of youth players- like in 2011/12, but that's not the case.
What is the author actually suggesting we do differently in relation to the Europa League? The only thing I can think of, realistically, is resting the best players for the league games before EL knock out ties, which is unlikely.
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I think its important to note if England keeps performing so badly in Europe we will soon lose the 4th CL spot to Italy and then qualification for the CL through the league will be nigh on impossible! I'm sure the FA could do more to help English clubs perform better in Europe with better fixture arrangements however we could have also made a better go of it against Fiorentina.
Kane didn't start either game for example. It was a shame the league cup final fell 3 days after the away leg however surely the sensible thing would have been to go all out in the home leg and rest some players for the 2nd leg if we had a decent lead. If we didn't get a good result at home we could have rested some players for the West Ham game and played a full strength team in the away leg. Hindsight is good though and Poch could have looked like a genius if it had all worked out.
ochserious2:
Kane didn't start either game for example. It was a shame the league cup final fell 3 days after the away leg however surely the sensible thing would have been to go all out in the home leg and rest some players for the 2nd leg if we had a decent lead. If we didn't get a good result at home we could have rested some players for the West Ham game and played a full strength team in the away leg. Hindsight is good though and Poch could have looked like a genius if it had all worked out.
ochserious2:
I still think we ought to be able to qualify for the knockout stages without playing a single first teamer for the following Sunday. Assuming we sign a midfielder and winger, that would mean a line up of:
Vorm
Yedlin Dier Wimmer Davies
Mason Stambouli/Carroll
Lamela Dembele Protchard
Austin/ings/whomever
And thats not even including Yoof like Veljikovic, Delle Ali, Winks & Onumah who will looking for minutes.
If we start inserting Rose for example, that means Ben Davies isn't getting minutes.
So come Feb, we can start playing our 1st choice team for home games and, depending on opposition, 2nd choice or a hybrid of the 2 for the away leg.
this also pre-supposes that we have a set 1st team which in reality is likley to be fluid with the likes of Dier or Lamela forcing their way in (potentially) or injuries changing things up.
I guess the above is a long winded way of saying the group stage ought to be easy enough to actually be necessary for is to give our fringe guys playing time.
Vorm
Yedlin Dier Wimmer Davies
Mason Stambouli/Carroll
Lamela Dembele Protchard
Austin/ings/whomever
And thats not even including Yoof like Veljikovic, Delle Ali, Winks & Onumah who will looking for minutes.
If we start inserting Rose for example, that means Ben Davies isn't getting minutes.
So come Feb, we can start playing our 1st choice team for home games and, depending on opposition, 2nd choice or a hybrid of the 2 for the away leg.
this also pre-supposes that we have a set 1st team which in reality is likley to be fluid with the likes of Dier or Lamela forcing their way in (potentially) or injuries changing things up.
I guess the above is a long winded way of saying the group stage ought to be easy enough to actually be necessary for is to give our fringe guys playing time.
lol they were an absolute pain in the ass on the road to our (Kaa gent) first league title in history, played some decent football too
Needless to say, I was absolutely delighted when they qualified for Europa the other day! :bentalebscream:
But they went through a very rough period last few years, almost bankrupt and relegated. New management and president turned it around, impressively
England is absolutely, 100% assured of losing a Champions League qualification the year we finish fourth. We are Spurs.I think its important to note if England keeps performing so badly in Europe we will soon lose the 4th CL spot to Italy and then qualification for the CL through the league will be nigh on impossible! I'm sure the FA could do more to help English clubs perform better in Europe with better fixture arrangements however we could have also made a better go of it against Fiorentina.
Kane didn't start either game for example. It was a shame the league cup final fell 3 days after the away leg however surely the sensible thing would have been to go all out in the home leg and rest some players for the 2nd leg if we had a decent lead. If we didn't get a good result at home we could have rested some players for the West Ham game and played a full strength team in the away leg. Hindsight is good though and Poch could have looked like a genius if it had all worked out.
Or we'll finish third and lose the qualifier....
Same old same old. Same arguments that have been made for the past half a dozen seasons, so, with respect to the article's author, this is not a revelatory set of comments. It was true last year, and the year before that, and it will be true next year. Any fan that thinks it's not worth being in Europe needs their head examined.
Surely, once it goes beyond the group it is no more or less a knock out competition than any other? Arguably we face teams more along our level, so what makes it different from the FA Cup or League Cup in that regard? Most knock-out competitions are a case of runs of a bit or luck and a bit of quality. The EL is no different. We have at least 8 other teams of our level to compete with to win. But, so what? That's not a reason not to try.