Ange Postecoglou

[Kid Chameleon]

I still have faith in Ange. He's the first manager I've liked in a long while and whatever problems we've got, he'll sort them out.

The problems we're seeing now are the same problems that have been dogging us for the last five years. It's not a situation that's going to fix itself overnight but with Ange I feel we have someone who is determined to change things and be successful. I never felt that with Mourinho, Nuno or Conte.

 

[daveyboy88]

Needs to stop the bleeding v Liverpool. Even a narrow loss can be accepted give its Anfield. But if we get slapped up then the pressure will go up a level higher than it already is.

a defeat of more than 2 goals is a sign hes probably lost the dressing room. i think hes lost some of them already, more will follow i reckon.

 

[AussieYiddo]

a defeat of more than 2 goals is a sign hes probably lost the dressing room. i think hes lost some of them already, more will follow i reckon.

'Lost the dressing room' always gets used as an easy cliche but this might be the silliest way of using it I've ever seen. You're looking at football completely linear, In terms of genuinely bad performances this year we've probably had:
- Chelsea (A)
- Newcastle (A)
- Fulham (A)
- Wolves (H)
- Wolves (A)
- Brighton (A)

6 games all year that had no redeeming qualities, we smashed up a high flying Villa 4-0 only 6 weeks ago. Do you really think that's what a team where the manager has 'lost the dressing room' looks like? We finished 8th last year and lost our best ever player on the eve of the season, what were you expecting? I understand our blistering start raised everyone's expectations but why are we punishing the manager/club for starting a season well? Go back to the threads at the start of the year and look what people wanted from this season, literally all of them will say 'play good football and show signs of improvement and I'll be happy'. We've far exceeded that, why have the goalposts moved? I hate how reactionary our online fanbase is, it's embarrassing.

 

[Tanner Baw Player]

'Lost the dressing room' always gets used as an easy cliche but this might be the silliest way of using it I've ever seen. You're looking at football completely linear, In terms of genuinely bad performances this year we've probably had:
- Chelsea (A)
- Newcastle (A)
- Fulham (A)
- Wolves (H)
- Wolves (A)
- Brighton (A)

6 games all year that had no redeeming qualities, we smashed up a high flying Villa 4-0 only 6 weeks ago. Do you really think that's what a team where the manager has 'lost the dressing room' looks like? We finished 8th last year and lost our best ever player on the eve of the season, what were you expecting? I understand our blistering start raised everyone's expectations but why are we punishing the manager/club for starting a season well? Go back to the threads at the start of the year and look what people wanted from this season, literally all of them will say 'play good football and show signs of improvement and I'll be happy'. We've far exceeded that, why have the goalposts moved? I hate how reactionary our online fanbase is, it's embarrassing.

Well said palont think embarrassing even covers it.

 

[Deuterz]

'Lost the dressing room' always gets used as an easy cliche but this might be the silliest way of using it I've ever seen. You're looking at football completely linear, In terms of genuinely bad performances this year we've probably had:
- Chelsea (A)
- Newcastle (A)
- Fulham (A)
- Wolves (H)
- Wolves (A)
- Brighton (A)

6 games all year that had no redeeming qualities, we smashed up a high flying Villa 4-0 only 6 weeks ago. Do you really think that's what a team where the manager has 'lost the dressing room' looks like? We finished 8th last year and lost our best ever player on the eve of the season, what were you expecting? I understand our blistering start raised everyone's expectations but why are we punishing the manager/club for starting a season well? Go back to the threads at the start of the year and look what people wanted from this season, literally all of them will say 'play good football and show signs of improvement and I'll be happy'. We've far exceeded that, why have the goalposts moved? I hate how reactionary our online fanbase is, it's embarrassing.

We lost a fantastic player, yeah. We also got a handful of them through the door for Ange and then a couple more in January.

The reason people are less forgiving is absolutely because of the drop off. And yes that matters and yes it is rational. If we started poorly but saw continual improvement during the season you would logically have less reason to doubt the coach as you could see the more time he had with players, the better they became.

Watching the opposite unfold, where the more time the coach has had with them the worse we’ve become, is concerning. It’s obviously not ‘sack Ange!!’ time yet, but absolutely is it normal and reasonable to question why despite one game a week and loads of time to train the players we have declined.

The recent ‘performances’ especially deserve a lot of scrutiny. This team did not turn up at St James’ or the Bridge. Period. And in fact the quality of our football has declined for months, only playing the likes of Luton, Forest, Everton etc allowed us to get away with this.

In summary, people can expect fans to ignore the reversing backwards in terms of progress all they like. They won’t and they shouldn’t. I expected a tough season but I think it’s weird how bad we turned at some point. We’re worse now than we were when we had half a squad out to injury.

Why? How? What is Ange doing in the very large amount of time he’s had to train with them to cause us to go backwards so blatantly? Should we back the coach with another 150-200m when we’ve got worse as the season goes on and will probably lose 5 of our last seven games?

Good questions. Fair questions. Not embarrassing or anti-Ange or hysterical at all but smart considerations. I for one am glad the cult like, delusional worship stage is past.

 

[Top Corner10]

Ange style of play requires the right players in key positions. Critical are centre backs, full backs/ inverted, the six, and forward line with two wingers who can deliver quality crosses and finish well. We‘ve lacked in all these key positions since start of year most of the time, esp last couple of games without any first choice left side players. Ange whole system of play isn’t working without these key positions filled by players of the right calibre - in those positions. Emerson was great as emergency centre half but cannot operate as Ange needs a left fullback/ inverted player.
Vic inexperience has been exposed on corners, as indeed has Mickey VdV defending lots of set plays. They’re young and in a first season at a level they’ve never played before. This true of Brennan too.
Werner can do some of what’s necessary but cannot finish and we knew that when we signed him to cover absence of Manor S.
It‘s taking a while for Maddison and Bentancur to find true form and neither can manage more than about 65/70 mins currently. PEH isn’t an Ange ball player despite some other good qualities. Nor is Skipp. And Richy needs a run of games to find confidence - he’s run out of road now with that perhaps.
Underlying all is a squad that is simply not deep enough with the quality required esp in the key positions to play Ange style of play well consistently. Let’s hope the window goes well and that with better and more suited players in key positions, the consistency level rises. Ange can then pay more attention to tactical tweaking of his playing style rather than fighting a constant battle to get the basics of the style in place every week.

 

[Zomb]

I’m still supportive of his ideas and coaching

I’m not convinced Levy and cretins will still support and back him if we don’t get CL. Stitch up incoming and I’m expecting next season to be written off an early sacking, or resignation after a Levy carve up and not backing him in the market

 

[Zomb]

Yep and we always lose our world class players because of it.

Don’t think Levy ever wants to sell top players, it’s just they want to leave rather than waste their careers under the rudderless, ambition less commercial investment vehicle - they seek to join football clubs instead

 

[BernardMatthews]

Ange style of play requires the right players in key positions. Critical are centre backs, full backs/ inverted, the six, and forward line with two wingers who can deliver quality crosses and finish well. We‘ve lacked in all these key positions since start of year most of the time, esp last couple of games without any first choice left side players. Ange whole system of play isn’t working without these key positions filled by players of the right calibre - in those positions. Emerson was great as emergency centre half but cannot operate as Ange needs a left fullback/ inverted player.
Vic inexperience has been exposed on corners, as indeed has Mickey VdV defending lots of set plays. They’re young and in a first season at a level they’ve never played before. This true of Brennan too.
Werner can do some of what’s necessary but cannot finish and we knew that when we signed him to cover absence of Manor S.
It‘s taking a while for Maddison and Bentancur to find true form and neither can manage more than about 65/70 mins currently. PEH isn’t an Ange ball player despite some other good qualities. Nor is Skipp. And Richy needs a run of games to find confidence - he’s run out of road now with that perhaps.
Underlying all is a squad that is simply not deep enough with the quality required esp in the key positions to play Ange style of play well consistently. Let’s hope the window goes well and that with better and more suited players in key positions, the consistency level rises. Ange can then pay more attention to tactical tweaking of his playing style rather than fighting a constant battle to get the basics of the style in place every week.

You sound like you watch us regularly.
Your comment below is pre Newcastle game in April.
You clearly didn’t see anything between December and April that bothered you too much??

“We beat them 4-1 in December with starters Vicario, Porro, Cuti, Davies, Udogie, Biss, Sarr, Kulu, Son, Richy, Johnson.
Subs we used included Gil, Skipp and Donley. They started Joelinton, Lascelles, Almiron. We’re so much stronger now and they have so many first choice missing. Ange got tactics spot on for us from the off in December I recall.
Don’t you think we should beat them comfortably?”

So what has changed your mind at this point?
Players or Ange getting tactics wrong. Ange Being out manoeuvred by other managers?

That’s a big flip flop of opinion from you anyway.
In your defence there were a lot of people saying Newcastle away would be a cakewalk. Not just you.

 

[Top Corner10]

I’m still supportive of his ideas and coaching

I’m not convinced Levy and cretins will still support and back him if we don’t get CL. Stitch up incoming and I’m expecting next season to be written off an early sacking, or resignation after a Levy carve up and not backing him in the market

I think Ange has lots of credit with Levy and the board. Full stadium and buzzing atmosphere most of the time with loads more people arriving early/staying longer inside stadium to increase match day revenues. It makes little business sense to fail to support Ange in the transfer window right now. Unless we’re deep in lower half of the table and obviously failing to play Ange style properly by Xmas, I think he’s got next season to get the team playing consistently well, with season 3 the one when tangible trophy-winning success or serious challenge for league/cups is required for Ange to keep his job.

 

[Top Corner10]

You sound like you watch us regularly.
Your comment below is pre Newcastle game in April.
You clearly didn’t see anything between December and April that bothered you too much??

“We beat them 4-1 in December with starters Vicario, Porro, Cuti, Davies, Udogie, Biss, Sarr, Kulu, Son, Richy, Johnson.
Subs we used included Gil, Skipp and Donley. They started Joelinton, Lascelles, Almiron. We’re so much stronger now and they have so many first choice missing. Ange got tactics spot on for us from the off in December I recall.
Don’t you think we should beat them comfortably?”

So what has changed your mind at this point?
Players or Ange getting tactics wrong. Ange Being out manoeuvred by other managers?

That’s a big flip flop of opinion from you anyway.
In your defence there were a lot of people saying Newcastle away would be a cakewalk. Not just you.

I was wrong about Newcastle, hands up! We had first choice defence and on paper the right players available further forward. They didn’t turn up - though had early chance for Werner gone in maybe game would have gone differently.
I’ve been bothered about Madders and Bentancur failure to find form since Jan and would add big drop in Kulu form since then too. The front three have never really got going well all year, save for a few games/ parts of games. Wingers who can cross and really score, a 9 that is mobile and can hold the ball well with back to play, or find space in a crowded box to nick goals.
So mostly it’s players, but I agree that Ange has been out-thought by other managers since Jan - Wolves, Fulham, City cup game, Newcastle away and NLD being prime examples. Ange won’t change his basic style though as that’s what is key to any longer term success so he’s vulnerable to managers who can exploit the weaknesses when we don’t have players of right quality in key positions to play Angeball.

 

[HampshireSpur]

Good questions. Fair questions. Not embarrassing or anti-Ange or hysterical at all but smart considerations. I for one am glad the cult like, delusional worship stage is past.

The cult thing I find genuinely interesting. Some intriguing parallels with Emilio Gentile’s work on political religion. The wisdom of the leader cannot be questioned and we must all blindly follow.

 

[BernardMatthews]

The wisdom of the leader cannot be questioned and we must all blindly follow.

Aka the ENIC motto.

 

[Zomb]

I think Ange has lots of credit with Levy and the board. Full stadium and buzzing atmosphere most of the time with loads more people arriving early/staying longer inside stadium to increase match day revenues. It makes little business sense to fail to support Ange in the transfer window right now. Unless we’re deep in lower half of the table and obviously failing to play Ange style properly by Xmas, I think he’s got next season to get the team playing consistently well, with season 3 the one when tangible trophy-winning success or serious challenge for league/cups is required for Ange to keep his job.

All seems sensible to me, but my instinct and 24
Years experience of Levy makes me very wary that he full support Ange financially eg If Ange wants Son gone, will Levy execute this quickly? No. At best, He will drag it out and have an unhappy player involved until late August or at worst, he will undermine the manager and keep him (as he won’t get the asking price). This will see Ange fail. I also think he will be wary in securing the two or three key players Ange wants to join if this season slowly chugs to an end and peters out

 

[Zomb]

Aka the ENIC motto.

All hail de fuhrer!

 

[rusty]

working on set pieces is that changing Anges system /style ? I can't see it changes anything in how he wants to play
folks are saying we need Anges players to gt system to work Well if the player is injuried/out of form does that mean the replacement has to be an Ange player ? we willnot get 22 Ange players here
for me coaching is about getting the best out of the players you have, sometimes if the RB is weak then you change the system slightly
I just don't understand when you have 3/4 hrs a day to train/keep players fitness level up, that you can't spend 30 mins a day on coaching set pieces, I just don't see how that is changing you style of play

 

[John Thomas]

We’ve had precious little to cheer about all season. Those home wins against Man U last August, the Dippers in September and the Robbie Williams lark seem like a long long time ago. Out of both domestic Cups at practically the first hurdle and no European Football (albeit I won’t blame Ange for that).

I agree you can't blame him for having no European football, but he's very culpable in not maximising the advantage that should have given us with extra rest and recuperation time between games.

 

[Starks]

Love this list. Some surprising results. AVB is in 3rd and he went on to become one of our most loathed managers in recent history. Both Redknapp and Poch are behind him. The two trophy winners are rock bottom.

And the previous trophy winner before them sits with them at the bottom with Venables winning 7 of his first 33.

 

[Audere!Audere!]

All seems sensible to me, but my instinct and 24
Years experience of Levy makes me very wary that he full support Ange financially eg If Ange wants Son gone, will Levy execute this quickly? No. At best, He will drag it out and have an unhappy player involved until late August or at worst, he will undermine the manager and keep him (as he won’t get the asking price). This will see Ange fail. I also think he will be wary in securing the two or three key players Ange wants to join if this season slowly chugs to an end and peters out

I think this HMS going thing is a bit of a fallacy.

He's not going anywhere. Ange rates him, he has a contract till summer 2026. This is the first possibility of him leaving.

He won't be going to Saudi for a payday, the guy will be rich and will have things going on in S.Korea that will keep the pennies coming in for a few decades yet.

Levy has seen what the potential is with Ange. It's only potential at the moment, as we all know.

When has the atmosphere been better inside the stadium than after some of those first games of the season? I live abroad so haven't been to a game, so someone else fill that in for me.

As a supporter, I had rarely felt as positive as I did with the new direction we had ventured on. The way Ange engaged and talked about the club, how he set up and what was being said about him by the players. Hell, even the back room staff clear out and revamp had me thinking we were finally starting to take things seriously.

As usual, it's now down to the owners to see if they finally come through.

I won't be holding my breath

 

[John Thomas]

Conte joined picking up from Nuno who had lost 5 in the league already and had to deal with stupid extra European games too.

Tell you what, I'd rather have had Conte taking us into those last two games against our bitter, most hated rivals.
Absolutely no way we'd have seen that embarrassing attitude given the circumstances and what was at stake.