Spurs v Villa 19/20 Ratings and Ramblings

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MOTM


  • Total voters
    140
Retro Control

This game very much had the feeling of 16/17 to me. Obdurate bus parker - check. Lots of control - check. Territorial domination - check. Lots of bumbly wastage of good situations - check. sucker punch goal - check. 4231 (eventually) - check. Better pressing (especially second half) - check. Strong finish to overcome the bus park - check.

The diamond vexes most of us, for a variety of reasons, and it's really hard to understand why Poch persists with it, after so many insipid performances with it last season. I don't mind the 3CM part of it myself (possibly because it's as close as I get to seeing the pure footballing format - 433 - but I hate the front two part of it, Moura's not a CF, he hasn't got the hold up play, he just whizzes around in areas too congested for him, it's like watching a pin ball machine. It makes us very narrow and easy to funnel us into areas that the opposition want us to play in.

Poch clearly switched us to a 4231 second half, and this almost certainly did change the dynamics, did give us more impetus in forward areas, but with the same personnel out there we were still looking offensively inept - just more frequently - in fact, shoving Sissoko up into the ARM position just added to the forward malaise and he wasted a guilt edged chance second half to match the one he dithered on first half. He wasn't alone though, everyone was bumbling about up there until Eriksen came on, and though I don't think he was "brilliant" enough for sammyspurs sammyspurs to lose his bet, he made a vital difference, bringing some much needed, and previously pretty deficient composure, focus and direction where previous it had been fleeting moments of Ndombele and Winks.

This was never a bad performance, not even the first half, we were thoroughly dominant, and again this felt like "vintage Poch", getting back to controlling games. With that type of control will always come the risk of the odd break, and they will always look like you are more exposed, that's the nature of a break-away goal, and by and large we barely allowed Villa a sniff throughout the 90 minutes, much different to last season where nearly all our games feature phases of losing control.

It has to be said Rose didn't cover himself in glory for that goal, and was generally his usual mixed bag of crowd pleasing gusto, a couple of midfield dribbles, one great cross, lots of careless passing, some stupid fee kicks given away, played there guy onside for another great chance for them, and plenty of forward wastage. Its not that he got caught out buy the long ball, the way play that can happen, but the way he commits harry carry and dives onto his arse was schoolboy stuff.

First half Winks was easily our stand out performer, I criticised him last week for playing too safe at times, but today he was spraying balls out to flanks and played some really zippy vertical passes (Winks forward passes 33, Sissoko 22, Ndombele 21) and that moment in the first half where he tears back, slides in ferociously, wins and comes away with the ball, then drops a shoulder and dummies their second fella and goes past him and passes it forwards was fucking gorgeous football. He also stayed on his feet when Trezuguet went through the way Rose should of, and forced him into a weaker shot.

It was absolutely baffling that Poch took him off before Sissoko, I can only assume that he was maybe feeling his previous injury and Poch was protecting him? because when even Bazali Bazali is calling for Sissoko to go off, you know he's having a mare. He was atrocious first half. When Lo Celso gets up to speed, and the emerging Skipp, surely his days are numbered. I think his best phase was that 20 or so minutes as an ARM second half when we switched to 4231, he was involved and could bare down on defenders, but as ever, his composure in forward areas let him down badly. His little run and pass to Kane at the end didn't disguise what had been a tough day. He was OK when pushed back in the two with Ndombele, but by then we were in total control and had them penned in their third, and there was nothing defensively for him to do.

Ndombele didn't set the game ablaze, but clearly showed glimpses of why we bought him, composure, vision, and scored an absolute pearler. He showed that he is good in both the CM3 and CM2 systems - in the same game in this case, played a couple of lovely passes, and when Eriksen came on you could see the interchange between two clever footballers and how they can bounce off each other and the whole dynamic improves, when Lo Celso comes in that midfield will have another bright, sure footed addition.

All in all this was a decent performance, not a scintillating one, but a welcome return to some of the old values for me. I like to see us control games through midfield, which we did, and once Eriksen came on that control turned into a stranglehold which eventually wrung a thoroughly deserved win out of the mangle.



Individual

Lloris - fuck all to do really.

KWP - A really solid game. Hard to get in behind when the game is compressed deep, but he was bright and confident on the ball, and contributed to our game play throughout. Be nice to see him get a run of games now.

TA - Solid.

Sanchez - Good game. I don't mind seeing more of him this season, I know he's not a Rolls Royce, but he's quick, tenacious, allows us to play high and pressure, and he's better on the ball than some give him credit for.

Rose - The usual Rose smorgasbord that divides opinions. Lots of chutzpa, lots of waste, some poor defending.

Sissoko - Really terrible first half, more involved offensively when pushed up to ARM second half, but incongruous in any team that wants to play football through it's midfield and surely the penny's dropping for Poch and his fan club?

Winks - I thought he was our best player first half and was amazed he was the one hooked, when there were three or four more deserving candidates to be hauled off. Played some nice football today, was the one introducing what tempo there was first half, played some nice passes and played vertically more than any of our other midfielders generally.

Ndombele - he can't have dreamt he'd scored a cracker last night, he was not exactly prolific for Lyon, but it capped a very quietly impressive debut, which saw some much needed control and composure return to a midfield that had become a quality vortex last season.

Lamela - Pretty poor and ineffectual first half, like others, he improved slightly when we switched to a 4231 and Eriksen came on. Did well to press and win the ball for the second goal.

Kane - Not great all game, but like others, this diamond just does not help him, too often him, Lamela and Moura were bumbling around the same piece of turf getting in each others way and runs. But did what he invariably does, kept at it, enjoyed having the 9 zone all to himself more once we went 4231 and came up with the goods in the end.

Moura - Not a great day, but he's not suited to playing this CF role, there's no space for him to open his whizzy legs and he isn't composed enough to operate in the tight spaces.

Eriksen - It was like a light was switched on as soon as he came into the game and that light made it easier for the likes of Ndombele, Lamela and Kane to see angles. I think we will still (have to) evolve into a different beast without him soon enough, but he showed today why he has been so important to us over the last few years, even when not scoring or assisting.

MOTM for me is tough. Winks first half, Eriksen second half, but the two halves amalgamated - I’ll give it to Ndombele for rounding off a quietly decent 90 with a superb debut goal .
 
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Winks - I thought he was our best player first half and was amazed he was the one hooked, when there were three or four more deserving candidates to be hauled off. Played some nice football today, was the one introducing what tempo there was first half, played some nice passes and played vertically more than any of our other midfielders generally.
I thought that was because he was slightly injured, he had a very decent game today.
 
Can't stand the diamond, especially against bus parkers, we're way too narrow and Lucas up top is a waste of time.

Thought KWP had an excellent game and I don't buy the " he needs to do it against City " bollocks I'm hearing off of some on here...WE as a team need to get that right or he'll get hammered by top draw players if he's exposed to overloads etc.

Rose got caught out 3 times today first half including the goal, put in 2 decent crosses the whole game and kept fouling Villa when they were struggling to clear their lines. Pretty meh all round.

Thought Sissoko was pretty shit until the game was won, TN was also pretty shit until he scored when his confidence grew and all the skills came out.

Taking Winks off (unless he was injured) was criminal. Eriksen showed his class, he's probably going but I really hope he stays, we need his class and composure and hopefully we can phase the likes of Sissoko out with the squad we have now.

Poch is the best manager at Spurs in my time as a fan (40 years) but tactically he really makes life difficult for himself. Oh and just saw his interview before the game, he's blatantly lying about Jan and Eriksen not being in the squad/starting 11....fuck knows what's happened with Jan.
 

JohnH

Supporter
The change in our fortunes during the later part of the second half was when we ditched the fucking diamond, Stevie Wonder could see it wasn't working and it was shit formation, why Poch took so long to see that is a mystery.
 
The main problem was starting the game without any bona fide wide forwards, only Son is genuinely that. Lamela, Moura and Kane is just not a good combination and I hope to never see it again. GKN would have been more effective than than Lamela in that he would gone into wide positions when there was space to. Lamela has spent his Spurs career avoiding doing so, just comes inside all the time and gets in everyone's way.

Villa had a Championship level defence and we should have smashed them 6-0 and gone top of the league. These poor first half showings were prevalent last season and we need to start games faster, get the tactics right from the off because you can't keep having to go into second halves 0-1, 0-0 or 1-0, which is what we've been doing too often for a long time.
 
Lloris - 6
Didn't have to do much and didn't save the goal.

KWP- 7.5
Decent performance. Didn't play any killer balls but he showed a willingness to beat players on the dribble that Trippier lacked.

Toby - 7.5
Clearly he didn't have a lot of help in the back four.

Sanchez - 6
Not terrible, but I don't know what he was doing on the goal. Clearly didn't have the awareness to realize a player was running in behind.

Rose- 6.5
Decent offensively, not great defensively

Sissoko - 6
Had an assist that saved his match but absolutely shocking when he had some scoring chances. Still plays a decent all around game but lacking offensively.

Winks - 6.5
Nice tackle to break up the counter on our corner kick but he didn't do anything noteworthy negative or positive.

N'dombele - 8
Showed real intent to go forward. Once the forwards are on the same page as him, he will pick create some key plays. His cross in the 1st half was our best chance till his goal. Easily our best midfielder.

Lucas - 6
Didn't really do much. Made a couple nice decoy runs but his off ball movement is weak. Needs to get in behind on crosses instead of standing and waiting for the ball.

Lamela - 5
Makes a lot of mistakes but his defensive work rate keeps him from getting a lower score. Helped start the 2nd goal, though it was very fortunate.

Kane - 8
Scored 2 goals so clearly a decent game. 1st was fortunate, 2nd was a great finish. Really should have done better on the header in the 1st half. Had a couple nice passes and a few crosses that our forwards made no effort to challenge for.

Eriksen - 8.5
Clearly MOTM. His cross helped create the 1st goal and villa was terrified when he had the ball. Would have had a higher rating if he played more.
 
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Totti

Chess extraordinaire
Winks, KWP, Eriksen all excellent.

Kanes reaction for his first goal and how easy he makes his second goal look just make him so good. Even when he has a poor game like today he can still pull that out.

N'dombele wasn't the best, especially in the first half. Needless body feints and not as comfortable in possession as I've come accustomed to. But was much improved in the second half, scary to think that Poch thinks he's only at 40% right now.

Great win though. Dominant from start to finish. Rose mistake aside for their goal, they barely had a sniff.
 

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The main problem was starting the game without any bona fide wide forwards, only Son is genuinely that. Lamela, Moura and Kane is just not a good combination and I hope to never see it again. GKN would have been more effective than than Lamela in that he would gone into wide positions when there was space to. Lamela has spent his Spurs career avoiding doing so, just comes inside all the time and gets in everyone's way.

Villa had a Championship level defence and we should have smashed them 6-0 and gone top of the league. These poor first half showings were prevalent last season and we need to start games faster, get the tactics right from the off because you can't keep having to go into second halves 0-1, 0-0 or 1-0, which is what we've been doing too often for a long time.
Son was suspended for this game ( and for next game) so not sure why you start by saying he's the only wide forward we have.

He maybe but this match was all about how to get the best out of the available players, not ones who aren't available.

Certainly arguable we should have started with a 4231 with Eriksen Moura and Lamela as the 3 - but only problem is there is nobody capable on the bench to bring on during the 2nd half - really don't think N'Koudou can do that role.

So until we get back Son Dele and/ or Lo Celso we may see more of the diamond to exhaust the opposition in the first half before bringing in the 3rd capabel AM in a 4231 in the second half to blow the opposition away.

Good news in that Son will be back for the match after next, which may also coincide with Lo Celso being available for ,45 mins or more ( he'll have been back in training with Betis/ Spurs for 4 weeks by then,).

Tricky next match as I suspect Dier ( and maybe Wanyama ) will be the only additional players Poch can start ( other than Vertonghen) which doesn't give Poch too many additional options
 
I'm giving it to KWP. I think Winks, Eriksen, Kane and Ndombele made up the other top 5 performances of the day but KWP didn't put a foot wrong and whilst I think Winks did some splendid stuff, nothing was there to go in for the kill. Forward passes Winksy, don't be afraid of losing possession trying to make stuff happen.

Eriksen did make the change but he was on for what 25 minutes and Kane the match winner but didn't sparkle like we all know he can when he is bang on one.

For me the most consistent performance today was Kyle, so he gets my nod.
 
I'm giving it to KWP. I think Winks, Eriksen, Kane and Ndombele made up the other top 5 performances of the day but KWP didn't put a foot wrong and whilst I think Winks did some splendid stuff, nothing was there to go in for the kill. Forward passes Winksy, don't be afraid of losing possession trying to make stuff happen.

Eriksen did make the change but he was on for what 25 minutes and Kane the match winner but didn't sparkle like we all know he can when he is bang on one.

For me the most consistent performance today was Kyle, so he gets my nod.
To be fair, Winks made considerably more forward passes than all the other midfielders, and he was on the pitch 30 minutes less than two of them.
 
Son was suspended for this game ( and for next game) so not sure why you start by saying he's the only wide forward we have.

He maybe but this match was all about how to get the best out of the available players, not ones who aren't available.

Certainly arguable we should have started with a 4231 with Eriksen Moura and Lamela as the 3 - but only problem is there is nobody capable on the bench to bring on during the 2nd half - really don't think N'Koudou can do that role.

So until we get back Son Dele and/ or Lo Celso we may see more of the diamond to exhaust the opposition in the first half before bringing in the 3rd capabel AM in a 4231 in the second half to blow the opposition away.

Good news in that Son will be back for the match after next, which may also coincide with Lo Celso being available for ,45 mins or more ( he'll have been back in training with Betis/ Spurs for 4 weeks by then,).

Tricky next match as I suspect Dier ( and maybe Wanyama ) will be the only additional players Poch can start ( other than Vertonghen) which doesn't give Poch too many additional options
Given the opposition, I think he could have started GKN. He's the forgotten man, everyone thinks he's on his way, but they thought that about Sissoko this time last year.

He would have provided some natural width. He was on the subs bench and came on, so he's obviously been doing something right in training.
 

BangkokSpud

Supporter
Different season same old prejudices -

Blakey if you can't see why Poch took of Winks and not Sissoko then you seriously need a refresher course in how football games are won ... let's review what happened

First half as expected we were dominant in possession, Winks was excellent 96% pass success floated around the middle of the park with time and space, even managed a decent tackle, but created nothing in the attacking third, in fact not one completed pass to a player in the final third, no problem that's not his job. Sissoko who played ten yards further forward saw the ball about half as often as Winks he also created very little but over the ninety minutes he did attempt seventeen passes/shots in the final third

So why take Winks off? Well quite frankly because the job he was doing wasn't needed anymore, we didn't need another 100 passes in the middle of the park, I'm not being critical he does his job brilliantly but his job for the day was done, we needed another body creating balls into the last third and we had Eriksen on the bench. Sissoko on the other hand can run for ever he continued to charge forward crucially dragging midfield and defenders all over the place (simply not a role Winks can do) and whilst Sissoko was his usual mix of brilliance and buffoonery he was a key part of the eventual overload on the Villa defence ... that's why he stayed on.

You keep expecting Sissoko to become Messi, that's simply not going to happen, he's our bull in a china shop a role he does very well. If you're still not convinced ask any opposition midfield player or defender, they will all tell you Sissoko is a beast just never stops .... and they are the ones who should know.

and if you're still not convinced look at the result - after Winks went off Eriksen came on we scored three goals ... how is that the wrong choice?

As for the rest of them ...

Defence - Lloris and his back four had pretty much bugger all to do, Villa put Hugo under no pressure at all, he managed 100% pass success just rolling it out to the CB's. KWP and Danny got forward OK but as our only real wide options we struggled to create much from out on the flanks. Sessegnon and Son will help. 8/10

Midfield - dominated possession as expected, Sissoko, Winks, Ndombele didn't create enough Sissoko was his usual self you loves him or hates him, Winks was superb probably MoM however he's our recycler not our creator, Ndombele looks a few games away from his best (hardly surprising) Eriksen came on and Villa were to knackered to deal with him, master class pulling the strings ... feck he's good. 8/10

Attack - too narrow, needed to pull wide far more in the first half, all those balls into the box were far to easy for the compact Villa defence to deal with, that said we created enough shooting chances (31) and no surprise Heaton was Villa's man of the match, crucially when it mattered Kane took the chances. 6/10

Poch - not sure what he told the front three to do but we had no width, back five and central three no issues, set up for possession football and that's what they produced. As usual with Poch no panic, took 64 minutes to make the change we all knew was needed, he trusted the front three to get it done and they did. No lover of the "diamond" but with eight players missing his options were limited ... 7/10
 
To be fair, Winks made considerably more forward passes than all the other midfielders, and he was on the pitch 30 minutes less than two of them.
It's more killer passes I want to see from Winks. Assist attempted passes which I still see far too little of in his game. Add that and he's a gem. Add a few goals per season as well and he'd become a genuine star. It's ultimately up to him but his ceiling is so high if he were to begin attempting the more daring, reward gaining things in the game. Take a punt and believe in himself more
 
It's more killer passes I want to see from Winks. Assist attempted passes which I still see far too little of in his game. Add that and he's a gem. Add a few goals per season as well and he'd become a genuine star. It's ultimately up to him but his ceiling is so high if he were to begin attempting the more daring, reward gaining things in the game. Take a punt and believe in himself more
Fair points normally, and I said something similar last week, but I thought he was good today. Playing that anchoring 4 role, I' not expecting him to get assists and goals so much, I just want to see him making better decisions at the early phase, taking more chances, seeing and playing passes that skip B and go from A to C, help us break lines etc. And I saw signs of that today.

He's never going to be Pirlo, and I'm not sure his ceiling is going to be as high as someone like Skipp, who I'm already seeing more potential in, but if he can at least keep developing he'll have a decent career, and I think it speaks volumes for the kid that Poch has continually used and trusted him as that central pivot - and he's rarely let us down in that role.
 
If anyone is for fault for the Villa goal it’s Winks. He is supposed to be at the base of the diamond covering the CBs when the opposition have the ball instead he’s far up field on the right. In fact when the ball is played forward Rose is our only player on the left hand side of the field which would seem to suggest that the whole team’s shape is wrong.
KWP was our most consistent player over the 90. My MOM.

Not a Sissoko hater but thought he was poor today. The lack of confidence he has in his own technical ability means he becomes far too indecisive when he finds himself in a promising situation.

When is Poch going to admit that the Diamond just doesn’t work. It leaves us exposed out wide and allows them to defend narrow. N’Dembele is wanted on the flanks if the diamond. He needs to be in the Centre to be effective. we need to play 4231 or 433 to get the best out of him.

Play like we did today, especially in the 1st half, next week and City will have a field day given how dangerous their wide men are.
 
The main problem was starting the game without any bona fide wide forwards, only Son is genuinely that. Lamela, Moura and Kane is just not a good combination and I hope to never see it again. GKN would have been more effective than than Lamela in that he would gone into wide positions when there was space to. Lamela has spent his Spurs career avoiding doing so, just comes inside all the time and gets in everyone's way.
LOL yeah I'm sure Pochettino would have been delighted in that first half if Lamela had have stayed wide and not come centrally when he was selected as a number 10. Do you actually know where a 10 plays?

It says a lot about your moronic crusade against him that you actively want him to do things that he's not even being asked to do by the manager. He wasn't selected as a winger, or even a wide forward for that matter. Why the fuck would he stay wide? Second half when he was asked to play on the left at the start of the half, he did, but that doesn't suit his best attributes, which is finding those little balls in tight areas and his ability to win the ball high up the picth.

As for me, I'm glad he did stay centrally because it was ulteimately him in the middle and his tenacity that played a massive role in us getting the 3 points.
 

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