Kyle Walker-Peters

[Spursidol]

I can only base what I see at men's level. I really couldn't care less what he does against a bunch of kids. Most of whom won't even make it in the Championship. He's looked good on occasion but no where near good enough to start for us consistently. I am sure that'll change with more game time as its clear Poch rates him.

Quite a few recommended Dele on here. But when you're putting up those sort of numbers in lower leagues at a young age you take notice. Dele, once again though, got given his chance due to injuries. I also think it's a special case with Dele. His potential is world class. KWPs isn't.

You're naming players (besides Foyth) who all played 50+ games of men's football before even playing for us though. And even Foyth only got game time in cups or when players were out injured. Like KWP.

9 appearances and 1 goal for a 3rd choice full back last season is a pretty good return to be honest and he already looks on course to making more appearances this season.

A number of people had noticed Dele because of his astonishing stats at MK Dons - but virtually everyone assumed he was bring bought for the future, and might even have been loaned out (after his loan back to MK Dons).

I had information via an Agent that he was looking very good in training and would definitely be part of the first team squad after he arrived permanently at Spurs, but I was still astonished that he started so soon in his first season, and after that his performances ensured he stayed in the team.

But I still think that most assumed he was bought for the future (which apparently why Liverpool failed to land him) or to start off as a first team squad fringe player, rather than get a chance as soon as he did.

 

[Totti]

A number of people had noticed Dele because of his astonishing stats at MK Dons - but virtually everyone assumed he was bring bought for the future, and might even have been loaned out (after his loan back to MK Dons).

I had information via an Agent that he was looking very good in training and would definitely be part of the first team squad after he arrived permanently at Spurs, but I was still astonished that he started so soon in his first season, and after that his performances ensured he stayed in the team.

But I still think that most assumed he was bought for the future (which apparently why Liverpool failed to land him) or to start off as a first team squad fringe player, rather than get a chance as soon as he did.

No doubt - I think his impressive pre-season probably helped him (in the same way it has probably helped Skipp this season). He was only given the opportunity when Bentaleb and Pritchard both got injured though (though I assume he was probably ahead of Pritchard in the pecking order anyway) and he took the ball and ran with it, literally.

Would be astonished to see anything like that happen with a lower league player in the Premier League again. Plus, we were a different animal back then. Coming off a 5th placed finish, no expectations of really challenging too much etc. - whereas now some people think we should be competing for the title every single season so giving young players and signing lower league players and starting them would be tough for us when it's better players who could help take us to the next level.

 

[bus-conductor]

And how would our lovely fan base have reacted if we sold Walker and promoted Walker-Peters?

We had to sign a high profile RB.

Worrying about what the "fanbase" thought didn't seem to be an issue this summer?

Aurier was nothing to do with appeasing the fan base, it was all to do with Poch wanting another experienced RB, who then ended up needing more time to settle in (and is still not putting in consistent good performances) than KWP would have.

It's the same with Sissoko and Onomah. Imagine if Onomah had been given the 3120 minutes that Sissoko's been given the last three seasons? Would we really be any worse off than what we've ended up getting from Sissoko over those three seasons. Two seasons of abject shite, half a season of competence with a couple of shite games and a couple of good ones - at worst - at best we might have have developed a player much better than Sissoko?

 

[Totti]

I imagine Onomah wouldn't have got anywhere near the same amount of hate - though I do think if we gave KWP and Onomah game time over the last 2 seasons, you'd have half the fanbase wondering why the fuck we're trying to compete for the title and have Onomah in midfield and KWP starting at right back.

That's football. We all want the shiny new thing. The new signing that makes people stand up and go "oh shit, Tottenham mean business here" - Winks has been starting for coming up to 3 seasons now yet you still have most of the Spurs fanbase wondering what he does and the rest of the footballing world saying he's no better than Tom Carroll.

I'm over it. I'll trust and back Poch over whatever he does and who he thinks is good enough to start games for this club. Onomah isn't even good enough for Sheffield Wednesday. All well and good saying Kane had some "failed" loans but he was also starting Premier League games at 21 years of age. Onomah will be 22 years old by the time his loan with Wednesday runs out and hasn't started a single Premier League game and has started just 9 Championship games in 9 months. Pathetic.

 

[sammyspurs]

Worrying about what the "fanbase" thought didn't seem to be an issue this summer?

Aurier was nothing to do with appeasing the fan base, it was all to do with Poch wanting another experienced RB, who then ended up needing more time to settle in (and is still not putting in consistent good performances) than KWP would have.

I guess you didn’t read this post then...

It wasn’t pandering to the fans, it was taking responsibility for our defence.
But it had no bearing on KWP being our plans.

As for this summer, the club felt that our targets were not available or not worth the asking price and were happy enough to stick with the team.

You see that’s the difference.

What fans want isn’t always what the club needs.
When we signed Aurier, we needed him.

Fans want a new central midfield, so what.
We could beat a full strength Barca tonight and they’ll still want a new central midfield.
We could win the treble and they’d still want a new central midfield.

And then they expect to be taken seriously and pandered to every window.
Transfer windows are not “gifts for fans day”.

 

[Airfixx]

I guess you didn’t read this post then...



As for this summer, the club felt that our targets were not available or not worth the asking price and were happy enough to stick with the team.

You see that’s the difference.

What fans want isn’t always what the club needs.
When we signed Aurier, we needed him.

Fans want a new central midfield, so what.
We could beat a full strength Barca tonight and they’ll still want a new central midfield.
We could win the treble and they’d still want a new central midfield.

And then they expect to be taken seriously and pandered to every window.
Transfer windows are not “gifts for fans day”.

This... In absolute spades!

Look how much of the Goons' fabled warchest Grandma Wenger pissed away trying to placate that bunch of entitled cunts.

 

[sammyspurs]

This... In absolute spades!

Look how much of the Goons' fabled warchest Grandma Wenger pissed away trying to placate that bunch of entitled cunts.

Always cracks me up that people hold up Liverpool’s spending as a mark of improvement.
Shall we look at what they’ve spent in ten years, and then compare PL finishes?
Probably spent about 800M on players and been in Europe three times.
This team spent 100M on Benteke, Ings and Carroll.

But win it this year and it will PROOF of their brilliant policy.
They’ve actually done far better since Klopp started bringing kids through, but don’t mention the war...

 

[Cripps14]

It wasn’t pandering to the fans, it was taking responsibility for our defence.
But it had no bearing on KWP being our plans.

Ok, then I misunderstood the gist of the previous post.

 

[FightingIllini]

Always cracks me up that people hold up Liverpool’s spending as a mark of improvement.
Shall we look at what they’ve spent in ten years, and then compare PL finishes?
Probably spent about 800M on players and been in Europe three times.
This team spent 100M on Benteke, Ings and Carroll.

But win it this year and it will PROOF of their brilliant policy.
They’ve actually done far better since Klopp started bringing kids through, but don’t mention the war...

It's a bit like they say about advertising, half of it is wasted, but the trouble is you don't know which half.

Sure, you're better off paying for Salah rather than Benteke, but you don't know who is who ahead of time. Liverpool wouldn't be Liverpool if they didn't buy either and were just making do with Daniel Sturridge or whoever.

 

[bus-conductor]

I guess you didn’t read this post then...

No, but I did read and quote this:

And how would our lovely fan base have reacted if we sold Walker and promoted Walker-Peters?

We had to sign a high profile RB.

On the one hand you are suggesting we signed Aurier to because we had to sign a high profile replacement for Walker to appease fans, on the other you are saying this:

It wasn’t pandering to the fans, it was taking responsibility for our defence.
But it had no bearing on KWP being our plans.

You seem to be contradicting yourself?

I'm a fan, and I didn't think we needed to sign Aurier, I would rather we made KWP back up and gave him the minutes to develop that we've ended up giving Aurier anyway, and he's still not established himself worthy of a first team place.

I completely agree that clubs (like ours - ie not galactic model) shouldn't purchase players to appease fans or sell merchandise. And this summer proved that we don't. I was merely disagreeing with your statement that Aurier was purchased to appease fans.

As for this summer, the club felt that our targets were not available or not worth the asking price and were happy enough to stick with the team.

You won't find a single post on here with me being overly critical of what happened in the summer. I think there were players out there we could have signed, that would have improved us, and fitted our remit (ethos, Poch, budget) but I would rather sign no-one than waste shitloads of money like we have on last ditch solutions like Aurier and Sissoko - to appease our manager (not the fans).

What fans want isn’t always what the club needs.
When we signed Aurier, we needed him.

Fans want a new central midfield, so what.
We could beat a full strength Barca tonight and they’ll still want a new central midfield.
We could win the treble and they’d still want a new central midfield.

And then they expect to be taken seriously and pandered to every window.
Transfer windows are not “gifts for fans day”.

If fans say stupid stuff it won't be taken seriously, if they say logical stuff it can be. Others who've known me longer on here know I really am not someone who a) believes we should spend money for the sake of it b) spending money on transfers isn't always the answer c) think we should also make better use of the academy players

But that doesn't mean all fan's opinions of what needs improving and how it can be improved is always wrong either. Liverpool reached the CL final, but still improved their keeper, and midfield, which most of footballdom, including their fans, wanted, and guess what, it improved them as a team.

I find some of the demand for upgrading our RB position, when we have Trippier (the most creatively productive RB in the PL last 24 months) Aurier and KWP, quite hard to logic.

But I think the majority of us can see we are very weak in midfield, our performances and the metrics behind those performances (possession, passing, pass completion, XG, XGA) support that, so you may not agree, but those opinions can be treated sensibly.

And even if we beat Barca tonight and get to the CL final, I will still think we need better midfielders than Sissoko, Dier and probably Winks, especially if we are never to see the real Wanyama again.

But again, Ive suggested that some of the answers don't have to be purchased. If we can't afford the player I like most, then I'm not going to spit my dummy out, I understand our model and the financial parameters of it. But Poch needs to show the bollocks to play people like KWP instead of wasting two years getting Aurier to the same level of basic competence.

 

[bus-conductor]

I imagine Onomah wouldn't have got anywhere near the same amount of hate - though I do think if we gave KWP and Onomah game time over the last 2 seasons, you'd have half the fanbase wondering why the fuck we're trying to compete for the title and have Onomah in midfield and KWP starting at right back.

That's football. We all want the shiny new thing. The new signing that makes people stand up and go "oh shit, Tottenham mean business here" - Winks has been starting for coming up to 3 seasons now yet you still have most of the Spurs fanbase wondering what he does and the rest of the footballing world saying he's no better than Tom Carroll.

I'm over it. I'll trust and back Poch over whatever he does and who he thinks is good enough to start games for this club. Onomah isn't even good enough for Sheffield Wednesday. All well and good saying Kane had some "failed" loans but he was also starting Premier League games at 21 years of age. Onomah will be 22 years old by the time his loan with Wednesday runs out and hasn't started a single Premier League game and has started just 9 Championship games in 9 months. Pathetic.

I think you only have to read some the comments in Onomah's thread based on 20 minutes of PL football over three years in the wrong position, to know that he wouldn't be given any more leeway than Sissoko and Aurier have received (less in many cases).

I don't know if Onomah ultimately has what takes, but if Kane was abysmal at places like Leicester and other championship loans, but then shone when put into a team with much better players, doesn't that tell us that it's not always black and white.

Sissoko performances ranged between fucking awful and meh for the first two years, I just don't think Onomah could have been any worse and maybe, just maybe, given time around a better team, might just have improved or shown his ability more. Either way, I just don't think we'd have been any worse off as a team, we'd have at least been able to move on a HG kid with some PL experience for 8-12m and not had the hit on Sissoko's fee and wages.

 

[sammyspurs]

No, but I did read and quote this:




On the one hand you are suggesting we signed Aurier to because we had to sign a high profile replacement for Walker to appease fans, on the other you are saying this:



You seem to be contradicting yourself?

I'm a fan, and I didn't think we needed to sign Aurier, I would rather we made KWP back up and gave him the minutes to develop that we've ended up giving Aurier anyway, and he's still not established himself worthy of a first team place.

I completely agree that clubs (like ours - ie not galactic model) shouldn't purchase players to appease fans or sell merchandise. And this summer proved that we don't. I was merely disagreeing with your statement that Aurier was purchased to appease fans.




You won't find a single post on here with me being overly critical of what happened in the summer. I think there were players out there we could have signed, that would have improved us, and fitted our remit (ethos, Poch, budget) but I would rather sign no-one than waste shitloads of money like we have on last ditch solutions like Aurier and Sissoko - to appease our manager (not the fans).



If fans say stupid stuff it won't be taken seriously, if they say logical stuff it can be. Others who've known me longer on here know I really am not someone who a) believes we should spend money for the sake of it b) spending money on transfers isn't always the answer c) think we should also make better use of the academy players

But that doesn't mean all fan's opinions of what needs improving and how it can be improved is always wrong either. Liverpool reached the CL final, but still improved their keeper, and midfield, which most of footballdom, including their fans, wanted, and guess what, it improved them as a team.

I find some of the demand for upgrading our RB position, when we have Trippier (the most creatively productive RB in the PL last 24 months) Aurier and KWP, quite hard to logic.

But I think the majority of us can see we are very weak in midfield, our performances and the metrics behind those performances (possession, passing, pass completion, XG, XGA) support that, so you may not agree, but those opinions can be treated sensibly.

And even if we beat Barca tonight and get to the CL final, I will still think we need better midfielders than Sissoko, Dier and probably Winks, especially if we are never to see the real Wanyama again.

But again, Ive suggested that some of the answers don't have to be purchased. If we can't afford the player I like most, then I'm not going to spit my dummy out, I understand our model and the financial parameters of it. But Poch needs to show the bollocks to play people like KWP instead of wasting two years getting Aurier to the same level of basic competence.

Haven’t contradicted myself at all.

I asked how the fans would have reacted had we not signed Aurier.
I also said he was signed because we needed him.

My only point is that KWP has been in Pochs plans the whole time, and signing Aurier didn’t change that.

 

[sammyspurs]

It's a bit like they say about advertising, half of it is wasted, but the trouble is you don't know which half.

Sure, you're better off paying for Salah rather than Benteke, but you don't know who is who ahead of time. Liverpool wouldn't be Liverpool if they didn't buy either and were just making do with Daniel Sturridge or whoever.

I’m still trying to work out if you’re an absolute genius or if makes any sense at all
Fine lines

 

[bus-conductor]

Haven’t contradicted myself at all.

I asked how the fans would have reacted had we not signed Aurier.
I also said he was signed because we needed him.

My only point is that KWP has been in Pochs plans the whole time, and signing Aurier didn’t change that.

It definitely drastically changed the amount of game time he (KWP) got though, and not for the better.

 

[Guido 🇺🇦]

Kept us in the game with his block from Coutinho

 

[ryminister]

Felt so sorry for him regarding their goal. Yet I didn't bitch about him. Just signed a new contract then next few days he's starting against Barcelona.
Big fk off ask, yet he dealt ok.
COYS
Love our stand by yoots

 

[Spursidol]

Kyle Walker-Peters may have lost the ball in the middle of the pitch that led to Barcelona scoring their goal, but how important was KWP's diving block in the box to deny Coutinho at the last moment in the second half?

Given his limited playing time over the last 3 seasons (a total of 10 appearances) to give him experience, didn't disgrace us tonight.

And remembering Aurier gave away 3 pens last season with reckless sliding tackles in the box, all players make the odd error. just a question as to what else they do after the error to recover the position in that game (preferably)

 

[Team Tanguy]

Proud of him. Wasn't entirely sure if he'd make it with us but now I'm convinced.

 

[SpiderSpurs]

 

[Totti]

I think we all felt a little sorry for him once that opening goal went in - but his game improved from there on. A few disappointing balls in the box when given the opportunity but he didn't shy away from the ball and actually made a few decent runs. He was absolutely buzzing on Dele's live instagram after the game so I am happy for him.

Best thing Poch could do for him is start him at the weekend against Burnley. I don't know how serious Aurier's injury is but no point rushing him back and I'm pretty sure Trippier is out so give him another game and see what he can do without the pressures of one of the biggest games in the clubs recent history on his shoulders.