Jan Vertonghen

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Airfixx

Take your miserable whining and fuck off.
TBF, I think Jan's "darker days" were over exaggerated then. He's had some dips in form, but so have many other players. Hugo has had some absolute blunders. Harry, Son, Dele have had long stretches of ineffective play before. Dembele didn't even look like much at first.

I think a lot of times we're far too quick to crucify players.
Darker Days as in Tottenham's, not Jan bringing 'darkness'.... :)

Personally, I defend out players to the hilt... I accept the concept of form as you rightfully note.

My concerns were of commitment/attitude. I don't think he was a happy bunny... Hence such an upturn from him when Toby arrived (I don't think of them like school kids so am generally reluctant to over-play their friendship, but a friendly face in times of struggle works wonders).
 
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Darker Days as in Tottenham's, not Jan bringing 'darkness'.... :)

Personally, I defend out players to the hilt... I accept the concept of form as you rightfully note.

My concerns were of commitment/attitude. I don't think he was a happy bunny... Hence such an upturn from him when Toby arrived. (I don't think of them like school kids so am generally reluctant to over-play their friendship, but a friendly face in times of struggle works wonders).
Gotcha. Wasn't a lot of Jan's unhappiness down to Tactics Tim? I remember there being rumors that if Sherwood had been handed the job full-time then Jan was going to demand a transfer.

I've no doubt Toby helped to raise his spirits though, playing next to Toby as opposed to Dawson/Kaboul/Chiriches/Fazio made his job 1000X easier. Rose's emergence and the signing of Davies likewise helped I believe, as it was pretty clear before that he was getting tired of life as a reserve LB.
 

Airfixx

Take your miserable whining and fuck off.
Gotcha. Wasn't a lot of Jan's unhappiness down to Tactics Tim? I remember there being rumors that if Sherwood had been handed the job full-time then Jan was going to demand a transfer.

I've no doubt Toby helped to raise his spirits though, playing next to Toby as opposed to Dawson/Kaboul/Chiriches/Fazio made his job 1000X easier. Rose's emergence and the signing of Davies likewise helped I believe, as it was pretty clear before that he was getting tired of life as a reserve LB.

OMG, the Jan/Naughton LB quandry... shudder:

I've no doubt Timmy going permanent would have seen Jan, CE, Dembele, Lamela, eventually Hugo all head for the exit... factions, power-struggles, back-stabbings... Our very own poisonous mini-brexit.

It's clear from Poch's book that we really were on the brink of something far worse than we realised at the time.

Doesn't bare thinking about...

- Andros & Lennon STILL plugging away on the wings...
- Having no clue about positions and formations from week to week.
- Every transfer window being simply a new influx of 'pwopah' (whilst still being passive enough to drink his shitty kool aid) lads.

...Oh, and as much as Timmy wouldn't like to admit it; no Harry Kane explosion cos Tim & Les would have been primarily concern with keeping Ade on-side thus enabling the continuation of the all important "everythings ok, honest"-salute goal celebrations.

Airfixx said:
"Dark times"
 
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OMG, the Jan/Naughton LB quandry... shudder:

I've no doubt Timmy going permanent would have seen Jan, CE, Dembele, Lamela, eventually Hugo all head for the exit... factions, power-struggles back-stabbings... Our our own poisonous mini-brexit.

It's clear from Poch's book that we really were on the brink of something far worse than we realised at the time.

Doesn't bare thinking about...

- Andros & Lennon STILL plugging away on the wings...
- Having no clue about positions and formations from week to week.
- Every transfer window being simply a new influx of 'pwopah' (whilst still being passive enough to drink his shitty kool aid) lads.

...Oh, and as much as Timmy wouldn't like to admit it; no Harry Kane explosion cos Tim & Les would have been primarily concern with keeping Ade on-side thus enabling the continuation of the all important "everythings ok, honest"-salute goal celebrations.
Looking back its shocking that Sherwood had his supporters, really. And some of those are still posting opinions here as if they have any merit at all.

:pochshock:
 
"Virgil Van Dijk has gobbled up the player-of-the-month gong. A defender has not won the player of the month award since March 2013, when Jan Vertonghen took it home. Look at Virgil, making defending cool again." From the newspapers.

First off, this Vertonghen thread is on page 4 only just above Josh Onoma. Who's on page 5? Eric Dier.

Maybe explains this, Jan was the best in the league six years ago. Have we taken him for granted or is he not quite as good as he used to be, because he has been playing at the top for a long time?

And congratulations Jan for being one of the few defenders to have ever won player of the month.

And we have to face up to it, Virgil Van Dijk is a great defender who really, really improves their team. He radiates calm around himself, he is mostly exactly in the right spot.
 

Airfixx

Take your miserable whining and fuck off.
"Virgil Van Dijk has gobbled up the player-of-the-month gong. A defender has not won the player of the month award since March 2013, when Jan Vertonghen took it home. Look at Virgil, making defending cool again." From the newspapers.

First off, this Vertonghen thread is on page 4 only just above Josh Onoma. Who's on page 5? Eric Dier.

Maybe explains this, Jan was the best in the league six years ago. Have we taken him for granted or is he not quite as good as he used to be, because he has been playing at the top for a long time?

And congratulations Jan for being one of the few defenders to have ever won player of the month.

And we have to face up to it, Virgil Van Dijk is a great defender who really, really improves their team. He radiates calm around himself, he is mostly exactly in the right spot.
Dunno what your're getting at... Jan's form over the last 18 months is better than ever.
 

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I know. I agree. Maybe it's simply he was truly outstanding nearly 6 years ago, has had dips and injuries and is now at near peak form once again. I loved that he was mentioned in the piece, showing how rare it is for defenders to be seen as the best player in any month.
 
Good to see him back but as first match back cann't help but think the reason he did not get closer to Rashford was lack of fitness. Should have been taken off after 85 mins as we were taking chances and vulnerable to a breakaway.
Would Toby who would have been closer to Rashford as fitter as he would have been on that side of the pitch if Sanchez had played.?
Either way Trippier's mistake was in their half and should have been defendable.
 
Good to see him back but as first match back cann't help but think the reason he did not get closer to Rashford was lack of fitness. Should have been taken off after 85 mins as we were taking chances and vulnerable to a breakaway.
Would Toby who would have been closer to Rashford as fitter as he would have been on that side of the pitch if Sanchez had played.?
Either way Trippier's mistake was in their half and should have been defendable.
i thought the same about Jan.
His position and/or his body shape was wrong, a yard to his left and he would of cut the pass out and then tied himself in a knot.
Not really blaming him after a long lay off and this being his first game back, he is still quality.
Tripps giving the ball away like he did was shocking.
 

Totti

Chess extraordinaire
Might be a bit premature as he's only just come back but is he.... declining? He's had some pretty bad injuries over the last few seasons and he is getting on a bit.

There has been plenty of times in the past few seasons where he's had injuries which have kept him out and he's stepped in immensely upon return but he's already had two injuries this season. The first time, he was clearly rushed back and had a shocker against Woolwich, gave away a penalty and then got sent off. Then went and suffered another injury.

Comes back today (rushed back?) and we all saw what happened. Slower then I have ever seen him. Defensively poor. Postionally poor.

But two of our losses to teams around us this season have come about because of Vertonghen starting his first game back from injury and looking like a competition winner.

I thought it was a mistake starting him to be honest, said as much before the game. An extra weeks rest and more first team training under his belt and Fulham away would have been a better introduction for him. If he DID play today, I'd have preferred a back three but Poch is the man and he felt Vertonghen could handle it. Unfortunately, he couldn't.
 
Might be a bit premature as he's only just come back but is he.... declining? He's had some pretty bad injuries over the last few seasons and he is getting on a bit.

There has been plenty of times in the past few seasons where he's had injuries which have kept him out and he's stepped in immensely upon return but he's already had two injuries this season. The first time, he was clearly rushed back and had a shocker against Woolwich, gave away a penalty and then got sent off. Then went and suffered another injury.

Comes back today (rushed back?) and we all saw what happened. Slower then I have ever seen him. Defensively poor. Postionally poor.

But two of our losses to teams around us this season have come about because of Vertonghen starting his first game back from injury and looking like a competition winner.
I agree with your points about todays match but I do think it's a bit premature though.
Certainly not up to match fitness today.
 

Totti

Chess extraordinaire
I agree with your points about todays match but I do think it's a bit premature though.
Certainly not up to match fitness today.
Yeah - it was fired up Man Utd under a new manager. Could well be premature, it wouldn't have been easy for any ageing centre half coming back from injury to go up against the pace of Rashford.

We could do with Vertonghen showing even glimpses of his best from now until the end of the season though because this season is the worst I've seen us defensively since Pochs first season.
 
Yeah - it was fired up Man Utd under a new manager. Could well be premature, it wouldn't have been easy for any ageing centre half coming back from injury to go up against the pace of Rashford.

We could do with Vertonghen showing even glimpses of his best from now until the end of the season though because this season is the worst I've seen us defensively since Pochs first season.
He's been suspect a few times this season, all of the defence have. But Jan seems to have more bad games than usual this year. Poch must have expected Lukaku to start otherwise why pick your slowest defence when Martial and Rashford play.
 
Big bump to give props to Vertonghen, whom I enjoyed seeing farther up the pitch today.

Thought he was our best player in the first half—put in some really good crosses. I appreciate that he doesn't overthink it or dally over the ball like our typical fullbacks. I suspect that's the defender in him understanding that it's not always about crafting in the perfect cross, but sometimes just putting the defense under pressure and inviting mistakes. With better finishing and some luck, he could have easily contributed to a goal or two.

Given our inconsistency on the left flank this season, I like having this as an option against teams that park the bus.

Oh and I enjoyed the tackle on Yedlin too. Long may his reign continue.
 
Had a very good game today and was largely untroubled. Great selection of when to cross (or turn inside).

I'm not sure I see him as a full time LB especially against pace (Rashford goal).

I'd prefer to see Rose back as Leicester and Vardy next.
 

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