Dele

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Oh yes he is.

And I'm saying this take of yours is utter crap. I've argued this with you for ages now.

So wait, you are saying Rooney wasn't an elite player? I thought he was crap for his last 3yrs at Utd, maybe longer, need to remind myself but that doesn't mean he was never elite.

Owen highly subjective but thought he only had one, possibly two good seasons in his entire career, I would never class Owen as an Elite player.

Bentley was only ever 'tipped' as potential, NEVER played at his potential for us or for Balckburn, NEVER went beyond potential ever, don't even get the relevance in bringing him into the conversation for comparison.

Dele has already played and performed at the highest level for us, he outperformed the tag "potential". He's actually played and performed as you would expect an elite player to do.
Of course Owen was an elite player. He scored 30 PL goals every season. No wait, hes never had even 20 PL goals a season.
 
They always talk about Spurs and the soft centre, weak mentality etc etc, Dele used to have fire in him but due to constant media attention to it we dialled him in a few degrees and as a result we just created another weak minded player.......Did anyone ever dial in Roy Keane? Eric Cantona? Paul Scholes? In their careers? Nope.
Born winners throughout their careers and the dial was never turned down, Ferguson wouldn’t dream of it.

I would say that those United players were in a different era. They were pretty filthy at times, but you could get away with a lot more in the 90s.

Not saying they wouldn't still be top players now - because you have also picked out 3 of the best players of a generation.

Scholes was one of the best footballers around. I don't think Dele is as good as him, certainly not better - but we might have one of the best of the current generation on our hands.

Would you say Wes Brown was a born winner?

I think some people, not just footballers - need a bad patch to come through better the other side. I just hope this is the case with Dele at Spurs.
Only problem with being Spurs, is there's a fine balance between players not being good enough for us - and players thinking they're too good for us.
Had Dele maintained or progressed from his previous levels - I expect he would fancy himself playing for Man City or something by now. The players in that 90s United side never needed to concern themselves with finding a bigger, better club to suit their level.
 
Why the fuck are Rooney Owen and David Bentley being discussed in the Dele thread?

Why the fuck is the name David Bentley name being put next to Rooney winner of nearly every major honour in club football scorer of 200+ PL goals and England's all time record goal scorer and Michael Owen an absolute phenomenon and arguably the greatest prospect ever produced in English football who had his career robbed by injury and still a winner of a ballon do'r and scorer of 100-150 please goals plus 40 for England and nearly 100 caps.

David Bentley the Woolwich reject who had 18 months of moderate success playing the role of a watered down Beckham for Blackburn fucking Rovers before failing at Spurs and working full time in the restaurant industry before he turned 30!
David Bentley was Blackburn's best player and given the ball a lot. He was not Tottenham's best player and did not get given the ball as much. Therefore instead of saying being given the ball in a good position 15 times a match he got it say 5 times. If he made 3 good crosses creating good goal opportunities from 15 chances he may have only made 1 for Spurs. Knowing his opportunities were less put pressure on him and if he mucked that up he had not had a good game and lost form. I think the same will happen to Eriksen, He is given the ball a lot for Tottenham but that will not happen at Real and I just cannot see him doing well even if they want him.
 
I know what you've said Sammy, I've disagreed with you the whole time and I still do. Posting some dude no one has ever heard of on Talksport as an expert doesn't make it right either.

It's called a difference of opinion for which we hold opposing views. Nothing more than that.
I didn’t post the talksport and you completely got the wrong end of the stick with that.

My only point was that I find it funny that lots of people denied Dele was poor, but now the media have picked up on it, it’s become an acceptable viewpoint to them.

You say you don’t agree with me but keep saying he’s been poor because he’s been moved to the wrong position.

It’s like the while Eriksen debacle....”he’s not poor it’s because he’s playing deeper and fatigued”

What’s “because he’s playing deeper and fatigued ” then. His poor form?

Rightio
 
I would say that those United players were in a different era. They were pretty filthy at times, but you could get away with a lot more in the 90s.

Not saying they wouldn't still be top players now - because you have also picked out 3 of the best players of a generation.

Scholes was one of the best footballers around. I don't think Dele is as good as him, certainly not better - but we might have one of the best of the current generation on our hands.

Would you say Wes Brown was a born winner?

I think some people, not just footballers - need a bad patch to come through better the other side. I just hope this is the case with Dele at Spurs.
Only problem with being Spurs, is there's a fine balance between players not being good enough for us - and players thinking they're too good for us.
Had Dele maintained or progressed from his previous levels - I expect he would fancy himself playing for Man City or something by now. The players in that 90s United side never needed to concern themselves with finding a bigger, better club to suit their level.
You kind of make it sound like Dale dropping off and not become too good is somehow a blessing in disguise, it’s stopped him from going City...

Im not Comparing Dale to any of those players ability wise but they had a raging fire inside them that made them the players they were, Cantona had it at Leeds, Keane had it at Forrest, and Ferguson never once tried to tone it down, not even after the Kung fu kick or Pizza gate .....winners need drive and determination, and bar Kane I don’t think we have another single player that has that fire burning...Way too many of our players are “ah well, it is what it is”......Son & Rose might have a little ember burning somewhere.
 
Why the fuck are Rooney Owen and David Bentley being discussed in the Dele thread?

Why the fuck is the name David Bentley name being put next to Rooney winner of nearly every major honour in club football scorer of 200+ PL goals and England's all time record goal scorer and Michael Owen an absolute phenomenon and arguably the greatest prospect ever produced in English football who had his career robbed by injury and still a winner of a ballon do'r and scorer of 100-150 please goals plus 40 for England and nearly 100 caps.

David Bentley the Woolwich reject who had 18 months of moderate success playing the role of a watered down Beckham for Blackburn fucking Rovers before failing at Spurs and working full time in the restaurant industry before he turned 30!

Because they are all players that burst into the scene but for various reasons didn’t really have the careers we all thought they would, either injuries, bars or whatever.
Rooney the most successful but still not looked back on as world class throughout his career.

People think this just WILL NOT happen to Dele, because.....because......because

Oh look, it’s already happening for two years..
 
Of course Owen was an elite player. He scored 30 PL goals every season. No wait, hes never had even 20 PL goals a season.
Bingo!!

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He was a very good player, plagued with injuries (mainly hammies which on the account of the fact his entire game was built on his explosive speed with every one of those injuries he just got slower and slower and slower, his game disappeared with that. The nail in his coffin was the knee injury he got playing against Sweden, nasty injury and was out for a season(??) following it, from that point on he was a myth).

But elite centre forwards scores more than +20 goals per season.....frequently.
 
Fair play to him for at least identifying there is a problem and getting off his arse to do something about it. Is it a coincidence that both Spurs and England have been pants while Dele's form has dipped... Yes ,I know, I'm clutching at straws...but give a guy a break :pochcmon:
 
I didn’t post the talksport and you completely got the wrong end of the stick with that.

My only point was that I find it funny that lots of people denied Dele was poor, but now the media have picked up on it, it’s become an acceptable viewpoint to them.

You say you don’t agree with me but keep saying he’s been poor because he’s been moved to the wrong position.

It’s like the while Eriksen debacle....”he’s not poor it’s because he’s playing deeper and fatigued”

What’s “because he’s playing deeper and fatigued ” then. His poor form?

Rightio
No, I've NEVER said he's been poor!

I've maintained he's been good and consistently put forward my case why I think this. The fact he's not scoring and assisting is the reason why people are/and have been saying he isn't very good you included.

I've been saying he's not going to score or assist anything like the prior numbers because he's playing much deeper and being asked to cover in a midfield that has lost one of the Legaues best players midfielders (Dembele), we have stopped pressing high and instead play a mid-block. He's performed well (not a standout, not a headline player) a functional industrious midfielder that's covering a multitude of issues to beset our team, not many midfielders will stand out in a mid-block, the whole premise is to choke the midfield (it often means at the expense of ours too).

The argument put forward about Dele's performance is comparing his gaol and assists numbers, I say this is total bollocks, it's like asking Kane to play CB and then say he's playing shit because he's not scoring anymore.
 
Because they are all players that burst into the scene but for various reasons didn’t really have the careers we all thought they would, either injuries, bars or whatever.
Rooney the most successful but still not looked back on as world class throughout his career.

People think this just WILL NOT happen to Dele, because.....because......because

Oh look, it’s already happening for two years..

A ridiculously long winded way of making a simple point Sammy

I'd hardly say Bentley burst onto the scene either!
 
Of course Owen was an elite player. He scored 30 PL goals every season. No wait, hes never had even 20 PL goals a season.

Owen:
Liverpool[192]
Manchester United[192]
Individual
(Not Elite)


Dele:

Milton Keynes Dons
Tottenham Hotspur
England
Individual
(Elite)


:dembele:
 
Hmmmm to some of the comments on this thread.

The only thing in many respects Alli has to be mindful of is not being talked about.

At present most have a strongish reminder of the guy's impudent and arrogant brilliance. Much like but on another level to Maddison but his dip from those heights is clear.

And to provide context Maddison is good enough I feel to be in every top 6 of last season's squad of today. Alli was a starter in each of those 6 at his best.

That's Alli, who at present merely flickers as opposed to shines as a constant star in our club's history. It's for him to rekindle the light.

Talk of Van Dijk being average or Rooney being anything than a fantastic Premier League talent is nonsense.
 
No, I've NEVER said he's been poor!

I've maintained he's been good and consistently put forward my case why I think this. The fact he's not scoring and assisting is the reason why people are/and have been saying he isn't very good you included.

I've been saying he's not going to score or assist anything like the prior numbers because he's playing much deeper and being asked to cover in a midfield that has lost one of the Legaues best players midfielders (Dembele), we have stopped pressing high and instead play a mid-block. He's performed well (not a standout, not a headline player) a functional industrious midfielder that's covering a multitude of issues to beset our team, not many midfielders will stand out in a mid-block, the whole premise is to choke the midfield (it often means at the expense of ours too).

The argument put forward about Dele's performance is comparing his gaol and assists numbers, I say this is total bollocks, it's like asking Kane to play CB and then say he's playing shit because he's not scoring anymore.

It's not really like asking Kane to play CB at all is it? That's just you trying to oversell your highly debatable point!
 
I'm exaggerating the point of course, because Sammy literally doesn't even acknowledge he's been asked to play a different role, which I find ridiculous.

You’re giving excuses for something all the time.
What? What are you trying to explain by telling me he played deeper?

You said he wasn’t poor so what is him playing a different role an excuse for?

And if he can’t adapt to play a whole ten meters behind his favorite position then he’s clearly not very elite
 
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