Conditioning Team Out?

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We're putrid presently, yet the core team got to the champions league final last season, and, we added clearly good/exceptional (potentially) players in Lo Celso, NDombele and Sessegnon.

Yet we are a shadow of the team we were, literally a shadow.

Haven't seen todays game, but it sounds the same old story = team on good momentum, built from being fit and cohesive from seasons start in Sheffield Utd Vs Us, destroyed by Pochettino's petty obsession with using hard gruelling training regime pre-season (todays players don't need this, they need their iodine checking, if overweight, shit like this, adjusting potassium maybe...).

Our squad, if fit from seasons start, and mentally at it, should be up their fighting Chelsea and Leicester. Not to dismiss today, but it's symptomatic of this broader picture IMO, too many players wanted to leave and have had hissy fits about the gruelling training I suspect.

Why do we never hear of the elite methods employed, which may disprove this is about early season fatigue? Why is world class recovery never mentioned when Poch and team are repeatedly quizzed about whether it's fatigue? High MSM, Alkalines (Kelp, Calcium(s)), masses of Oxygen enhancing techniques that we never hear about our club employing, do we have an elite nutrition/recovery team? How can we have a "Bring it" ethos, without an elite recovery focus, it's craziness.

If training wasn't so hard, we'd have had a fuller fitter squad, he rotates the shit out of them because they are all to exhausted to play regular 2x weekly (the stat in the week was over 80 odd games? since the last 'same team' came out... Maybe, just maybe, we don't have anybody highly trained enough, to point out they are all exhausted physically and/or mentally (can anybody cite who a technical employee would be who would oversee recovery techniques and nutrition? a GP style sports Doc? No offence to any, but the requirement to pass your medical Dr is 1 elective day on Nutrition, unless it's changed now).

Get them having fun Poch, whilst they recover, or do one pal. How about, they employ an elite conditioning team, like Klopp and Pep no doubt do...

Anyway, surely everyone can see it? I've bleated on about it since the signs in season 2.

It's like asking Curt Cobain to belt out the entirety of Nevermind and Bleach, before the gig, every day on tour in 91, then being mystified how his voice is torn to shit...
 
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Good analysis mate, team looked knackered today. Think their workload is far too heavy, obviously I don't see what they do in training but other top teams manage to play midweek in Europe and still cope domestically. Something needs to change, Poch has squeezed a lot out of this squad over the last few seasons. Think he just needs to be a bit more prudent with how they expend their energy,
 

Five

Supporter
We looked like old fucking men out there today. Triple training sessions killing us. Ndombele's been here a wet week and already picked up 2 muscle injuries.
 

ArcspacE

BINNED AGAIN
We did travel mid-week and essentially only had one full day to recover

Having said that - I think our biggest issue this season is our defence - we went from having the best back 4 to an assembly of average clowns with poor decision making. Until we sort out a consistent back 4 which doesn’t rotate every week - little would change, imv
 
We did travel mid-week and essentially only had one full day to recover

Having said that - I think our biggest issue this season is our defence - we went from having the best back 4 to an assembly of average clowns with poor decision making. Until we sort out a consistent back 4 which doesn’t rotate every week - little would change, imv
Well yes because producing one goal against Sheffield United is top notch attack? We have bigger problems than or defence.
 

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ArcspacE

BINNED AGAIN
Well yes because producing one goal against Sheffield United is top notch attack? We have bigger problems than or defence.
Our defence is dog-shit - we could have easily seen that game out 2-3 seasons ago - we now look like conceding every time a cross is put into our box. You always start building from the back
 
The team has been seriously overtrained since February. The endless league cup derby run of watford, spammers, woolwich, chavs x 2 during an injury crisis was just too much. Remember how Poch and the team was lauded for performing miracles around christmas time ?

Standard practice for overtrained endurance athletes is only light training for one to three months. This can´t be done in football.

I guess the PT professionals at the club warned about this problem. But he got caught up in the "never won a trophy" narrative and went all in on all fronts with a depleted squad. He knew that he was heading into deep trouble already before christmas and ditched the high pressing tactic except in restricted periods of games and managed the situation seemingly perfectly with a top four finish and a CL final.

The hope was that the summer break would help recuperate the squad back to normal health. But biology is a bitch - there are serious long term consequences to overtraining.

I have no idea about how hard he actually trains the players in between matches - but if he keeps training with high intensity in the current situation that is borderline criminal when the team is obviously not able to sustain high intensity for even 60 minutes during matches.

Poch´s philosophy clearly contains some sort of "mind over body" concept and he is/was willing to risk future problems for short term results. And now he is paying the price for that.

What can be learned from this:
- Fuck the league cup - every year - for ever
- Keep a large squad of players which you are actually willing to play
- Rotate before you feel you have to
- High volume high intensity training doesn´t work forever and doesn´t work in all situations
 
Our defence is dog-shit - we could have easily seen that game out 2-3 seasons ago - we now look like conceding every time a cross is put into our box. You always start building from the back
Well yes I agree. But the bigger problem in my book is how we play defence and how we attack, and that's more on the coach and the players.
 
Probably just coincidence but since Sebastiano Pochettino became head of sports science last year, the players are ‘tired’ and no longer able to perform at the level required? Yes, lots of other factors I know. Just a thought
 
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The team has been seriously overtrained since February. The endless league cup derby run of watford, spammers, woolwich, chavs x 2 during an injury crisis was just too much. Remember how Poch and the team was lauded for performing miracles around christmas time ?

Standard practice for overtrained endurance athletes is only light training for one to three months. This can´t be done in football.

I guess the PT professionals at the club warned about this problem. But he got caught up in the "never won a trophy" narrative and went all in on all fronts with a depleted squad. He knew that he was heading into deep trouble already before christmas and ditched the high pressing tactic except in restricted periods of games and managed the situation seemingly perfectly with a top four finish and a CL final.

The hope was that the summer break would help recuperate the squad back to normal health. But biology is a bitch - there are serious long term consequences to overtraining.

I have no idea about how hard he actually trains the players in between matches - but if he keeps training with high intensity in the current situation that is borderline criminal when the team is obviously not able to sustain high intensity for even 60 minutes during matches.

Poch´s philosophy clearly contains some sort of "mind over body" concept and he is/was willing to risk future problems for short term results. And now he is paying the price for that.

What can be learned from this:
- Fuck the league cup - every year - for ever
- Keep a large squad of players which you are actually willing to play
- Rotate before you feel you have to
- High volume high intensity training doesn´t work forever and doesn´t work in all situations
Where have you been all my life :)
 
Probably just coincidence but since Sebastiano Pochettino became head of sports science last year, the players are ‘tired’ and no longer able to perform at the level required? Yes, lots of other factors I know. Just a thought
Correlation not necessarily causation, of course. However, it is symbolic of the issue.

We have entrusted'Head of Sports Science (didn't know he was head), for a billion pound+ team/club, to a kid just out of university...
 
While you are here, could you answer my question about overtraining please?
Sure, where is it dude?

Just seen, it was to another poster so missed it.

The issue I see is a build up of lactic acid, firstly.

Then, that slows the lymph (drainage system), whilst the kidneys play catch up converting the acids through carbonic to re-use/expel.

This leads to issues like ankle turns and the like, as uric acid tends to be left at the extremities and the body subconsciously protects the area (leading to turns which swell excessively).

The muscles will have a tendancy to draw in a little, leading to muscular/skeletal problems (Magnesium getting depleted is a problems for all the above - kidneys need it for the carbonic conversion, muscles to fully relax, brain...). Calcium is needed for cell recovery after damage, this all is heightened when training is excessive, if Calciums run low then all sorts of issues ensue.

Basically you turn into an old person, until the backed up metabolic residue is cleared out, as best it can. If left uncleared then you get a knock there = ouch, massively amplified injury, as you have acid crystals left in an area which no longer gets oxygen (potentially) and minerals delivered to recovery it properly...

You do these things too much and athletes hit their own fields versions of 'the wall'.

This is a very crude 5minute slant, of what a few of the nutritional aspects can occur.

Training intensity doesn't need to always be physical, like they seem to have fixated upon, sadly.

All the injuries say all they need to (all metabolic drainage gates and muscles, largely). The constant "Hard Work" mantra is a broken record.
 
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What happens? And can it be remedied?
It can be remedied, but how long that takes depends how bad it is. The best female cross country skier of all time Marit Bjørgen got severely overtrained in 2005 and experienced significantly reduced performances for the three seasons 2006-2009 before dominating the sport again 2010-18.
 

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Don’t want to dismiss his expertise and qualifications but at 22, he’s the youngest in the prem. A touch inexperienced for a job this big? Unfortunately in most walks of life, it’s not what you know but who you know.
 
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